FAKE NEWS EXPOSED: A Service of PoliticalChat.com

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

Federal authorities are on pace to make more than 2.3 million arrests during the 2022 fiscal year, which ends Sept. 30. That will far exceed last year’s record of more than 1.7 million arrests.

https://www.texastribune.org/2022/09...s-record-2022/

Sounds like record-setting border enforcement. I thought you were for that.

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

So, in addition to muzzling (private) corporate speech, banning books from libraries and opposing academic freedom, your Dear Leader has said that the free press is "truly the ENEMY OF THE PEOPLE!", 61% of Republicans (and 78% of Evangelicals) said they favor “the United States officially declaring the United States to be a Christian nation,” and conservatives demand that privately-owned social media platforms host their dangerous propaganda and lies. So, tell me again how it is that conservatives support the First Amendment.

Oh, you mean the same news outlets that pushed the phony Russian collusion narrative for years?

Also do you stay up nights worrying about what evangelicals - and virtually no one else - think?

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

Oh, you mean the same news outlets that pushed the phony Russian collusion narrative for years?

Also do you stay up nights worrying about what evangelicals - and virtually no one else - think?

Just take the loss graciously. Jeez.

[donquixote99]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Just take the loss graciously. Jeez.

Whell is not able to do that. Very seldom does anyone on the Internet do that. The idea that discourse can lead to some sort of victory/loss recognized by one's debate opponent is a delusion. There are always ways for them to evade doing any such thing, no matter how excellent one's arguments, and they will always do so.

If you want a win, you need a structure where someone else can be judge of the thing and award it to you.

[RickeyM]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Just take the loss graciously. Jeez.

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Just take the loss graciously. Jeez.

What loss? Some folks sing in the shower. I suspect you practice spiking the football.

Let me help you with your deranged view us the dangers evangelical voters. Whatever influence evangelical voters may have had in prior elections, it's declining pretty quickly. The young voters that the Dems desperately need to get to the polls are the same ones whose attachment to religious beliefs are declining rapidly. So, please stop worrying about an evangelical caliphate taking over Washington DC.

Also, as far as the media being an enemy of the people, don't worry. Folks really don't trust the media anyway. Here's the way Axios puts it:

- Just 5% of Republicans said they had "a great deal or quite a lot of confidence" in newspapers, compared to 35% of Democrats.
- Only 8% of Republicans said they had "a great deal or quite a lot of confidence" in TV news, compared to 20% of Democrats.
- Independents' views are generally closer to Republicans'.

So, the media has pretty much lost the trust of Repubs and Independents completely. But they've also lost the trust of the vast majority of Dems as well. Only 20% of Dems trust the TV news, and only 35% of Dems trust print media.

Do you have any idea the gravity of that? The news business in this country has "devolved" to the point where only a small percentage of the electorate trusts them. That's not by accident. The media had to work pretty hard to fall that low.

Given that the media have unique protections, and a unique role, in this country, these numbers suggest they've failed pretty miserably, and they've surrendered their role as a mechanism to make the elected class accountable.

Chick's world. Sad.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

What loss? Some folks sing in the shower. I suspect you practice spiking the football.

Let me help you with your deranged view us the dangers evangelical voters. Whatever influence evangelical voters may have had in prior elections, it's declining pretty quickly. The young voters that the Dems desperately need to get to the polls are the same ones whose attachment to religious beliefs are declining rapidly. So, please stop worrying about an evangelical caliphate taking over Washington DC.

Also, as far as the media being an enemy of the people, don't worry. Folks really don't trust the media anyway. Here's the way Axios puts it:

- Just 5% of Republicans said they had "a great deal or quite a lot of confidence" in newspapers, compared to 35% of Democrats.
- Only 8% of Republicans said they had "a great deal or quite a lot of confidence" in TV news, compared to 20% of Democrats.
- Independents' views are generally closer to Republicans'.

So, the media has pretty much lost the trust of Repubs and Independents completely. But they've also lost the trust of the vast majority of Dems as well. Only 20% of Dems trust the TV news, and only 35% of Dems trust print media.

Do you have any idea the gravity of that? The news business in this country has "devolved" to the point where only a small percentage of the electorate trusts them. That's not by accident. The media had to work pretty hard to fall that low.

Given that the media have unique protections, and a unique role, in this country, these numbers suggest they've failed pretty miserably, and they've surrendered their role as a mechanism to make the elected class accountable.

Chick's world. Sad.

Let me get this straight. In countering my argument that the GOP's positions are often anti-First Amendment, you defend both Christian Nationalism and Trump's proclamation as President that a free press is the enemy of the people (both anti-First Amendment positions). As I said, you should just graciously take the loss. Instead, your unwillingness to concede ends up buttressing my argument. And you bristle when you and those like you are called fascists?

Meanwhile:

In the name of “curriculum transparency,” Florida’s Republican-controlled state government has appointed several anti-gay and anti-mask conspiracy theorists to take charge of a new effort at public schools: banning books.

This hastily assembled censorship council—tasked with retraining public school librarians to abide by new restrictions—is the latest ploy in Gov. Ron DeSantis’ crusade to upend the state’s education system.

But the council was also staffed under suspicious circumstances, with the state Education Department ignoring its own call for official candidates from local school districts and instead filling most of the slots with right-wing activists who have a history of proposing book bans.

The Education Department passed on nearly 100 potentially qualified applicants with relevant experience, records show. In Brevard County alone, it ignored the five submissions made by the bipartisan local school board. Instead, the department went with a woman who nominated herself: Michelle Beavers. While other candidates have teaching experience, Beavers’ bona fides consist of right-wing activism.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/florid...anning-council

[Chicks]

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Let me get this straight. In countering my argument that the GOP's positions are often anti-First Amendment, you defend both Christian Nationalism and Trump's proclamation as President that a free press is the enemy of the people (both anti-First Amendment positions).

Well, you're half right....sorta.

No one's defending Christian Nationalism. But to say it matters as a polling issue is irrelevant, both in terms of the "reality" of it ever happening, and the fact the evangelicals' clout as a voting block is far less than it used to be...and falling. Why you chose to bring that one up is a head-scratcher, which is why I asked if you really stay up nights worrying about what evangelicals might think. I sure don't, but I applaud their convictions if it helps them live a better life.

As far as the Trump quote, in context, he was talking about members of the press who were taking issue with the phrase "MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN!" He wasn't talking about the press in general terms and wasn't commenting about whether or not the press should be "free". But I know how you love to get mileage out of taking quotes out of context, so let's roll with your POV on this for a sec...

The reason I posted the opinion polls on the media is that it clearly shows that most Americans - Republicans, Democrats and Independents alike, and by huge margins - don't trust the media. Hell, there was one poll I saw that indicated that the number one thing that folks trust the media for is the weather report. Nothing else was even close.

Maybe this hasn't dawned on you, but if you're a member of the media, you've got to work hard - really, really had and for a long period of time - to get distrust numbers like that. What that tells me is that the media - in general terms because there are some good journalists out there - has by and large chosen to crap all over the very special role that they have in this country.

So, in that sense, it's pretty amazing that we've gone from “The freedom of the Press is one of the greatest bulwarks of liberty, and can never be restrained but by despotic Governments,” as quoted by the Virginia Declaration of Rights in 1776, to a state where criticizing a media that has abdicated its role in the maintenance of a free society is considered scary...by that same media....and of course, you.

Would I have chosen the words "enemy of the people" if I were Trump? No. I certainly have no issue calling out the press for its failures, though.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

No one's defending Christian Nationalism...

Nah, only 61% of your party (in a recent poll, 61% of Republicans said they favor “the United States officially declaring the United States to be a Christian nation.”

And here's a manifesto from prominent conservative intellectuals promoting exactly that.

https://nationalconservatism.org/nat...of-principles/

And there's more - Lauren Boebert: "I'm tired of this separation of church and state junk that's not in the Constitution."

Doug Mastriano has called the separation of church and state a "myth."

Ted Cruz: "We need to do a much better job as evangelists. Evangelists for Jesus, yes, but also in the public sphere as evangelists for liberty, for our values."

Here's the gal Trump says he's considering for VP for his 2024 run.