mosque near ground zero ?

[d-ray657]

I live in the Midwest. Even though I work in a city of around 400,000 people, and live in a metropolitan area around a million, I see friendliness all of the time. This comes from people of many nationalities and races. Sometimes, even when people don't seem friendly at first, they respond well to friendliness. People will give you a wave or nod and a smile, they say thank you when you hold a door, or hold a door when you need it.

Not all Muslims are Arab. Not all Arabs are Muslim. Did the store owners announce their religion? Do you know whether, if they were Muslims, they were practicing Muslims? Do you know whether it was their religion that made them unfriendly? Maybe it was a lack of faith that had soured their feelings. Maybe a language barrier made them uncomfortable.

In any event I don't see the logic of drawing conclusions about all Muslim practitioners on the basis of an attitude by a couple of store clerks. Similarly, one can't draw conclusions about all Muslims on the basis of acts of terrorism by a radical group within the Muslim Faith.

There were terrorists in Ireland, but that doesn't translate to all Irishmen. Long ago, the Catholics engaged in murderous crusades, but that doesn't mean that Catholicism is a murderous faith. Just 150 years ago, Americans owned slaves. Jim Jones, who professed to be a Christian, participated in a mass suicide/murder. Different nationalities within Africa have murdered others because of tribal hatred. A Slavic dictator murdered thousands in "ethnic cleansing." The blame for those sins and crimes does not belong to the races or religions or ethnic groups who perpetrated them. They belong to the sick and deranged among those groups who found various ways to manipulate hatred and ignorance.

Unfortunately there are those within this country that want to promote hatred. Too many people accept such vile messages because they don't know the truth, and, thus they are susceptible to the misinformation that promotes the message of hate. Shame on people like Gingrich, the Jewish Defense League, and O'Reilly, who know better, but for one reason or another, find it to their advantage to find ways to divide people. (I didn't include Palin and Beck, because I'm not sure they have the intelligence to know better) I believe America is better than that.

Regards,

D-Ray

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by finnbow

True enough about OBL's derangement. From what I've read, his biggest beefs were interrelated. Coming off the victory of the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan, he felt himself to be a conquering folk hero and wanted to continue in that vein to throw Saddam out of Kuwait in defense of the Islamic holy lands in Saudi Arabia. When the Royal Family overrode these grandiose plans, he was double outraged that they deferred to the infidel, America, to do their fighting for them in defense of Muslim lands.

This deference to the infidel tied into his outrage about the despots being propped up throughout the Mideast by the west (e.g., Egypt and the Gulf States) thereby precluding more Islamic forms of government from developing. I think in his deranged head, all this sh_t ties together seamlessly. Derangement has no bounds.

OBL is nothing more than a middle child acting out. We see him as deranged because he is acting out on an international stage instead of just within his family. He's not deranged nor suffer from any other physiological malady. He wants attention and he blows up things to receive it. All his anti Saudi and anti US crap is just justification for his acting out.

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

I'm aware of that, however it's tough to blame folks for thinking muslims are the enemy.

Pete

you have got to be kidding.

Sorry Pete this is an inexcusable post.

there is no justification for blaming hundreds of millions for the actions of a few thousand

good grief

let me know who these folks are that you find it hard to blame and I will have no issue blaming them

sorry

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by hillbilly

I think you should visit this area and spend some time here while your at it, not just a short stay. I think you'd see the quality of life as something you'd never want to change if you lived here your self. I've been many places, but always eagar to get back home. Theres nothing like people that wave at strangers, or talk to you at any store you go to ... unless it's one of those muslim stores, .. they are not willing to answer you when you walk into one of their stores and say '' howdy, you doin' alright today ... sure been hot today hasn't it ''. All they will do is look at you like your fucking dumb count and hand you your change. That is not how us locals act or live life. And and back to the mosque. I'm one of the locals that don't trust 'em. We don't tust or trade with anyone to good to speak when spoken to.

They open two stores in our county once. The phones started ringing all over the county as friends and neighbors passed the word on to everyone they knew for three towns asking not to trade with them. It worked. Wasn't very long until they closed the stores and moved on. There is no law saying people must buy from them.

You know what though? If they had just had the decency to look up and say, '' yes, I'm doing fine today thanks for asking .. and how are you today?.. and yes, it sure does look hot/cold out there today .. '',, folks might have just alittle bit more respect towards them. But it's hard when they are in their own click ( with the silent attitude of we don't give a shit about you or how your doing today .. we just want your money so hand it over and go ), and it's sposed to be ok for them to build their own communities. But it it's only wrong if American people wish to preserve a community and culture we have always lived. People only want to scream racism if your white and even sometimes black ( even if it IS NOT ), sad truth and people know it. They may not be willing to admit it's the cold hard truth, but oh they do know it.

I can't believe this post.

You conspired to run strangers out of town and somehow see this as a noble thing?

Your values are warped to my way of thinking and I understand why that ultimate insult to achievement (palin) in so popular.

I am getting out of this thread before I tell you what I really think.

[hillbilly]

Originally Posted by noonereal

I can't believe this post.

You conspired to run strangers out of town and somehow see this as a noble thing?

Your values are warped to my way of thinking and I understand why that ultimate insult to achievement (palin) in so popular.

I am getting out of this thread before I tell you what I really think.

Well it's clear you have a much different taste in music than us.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6HOniP-sZw



It's a good song and all but the ending of this one is the very best part. When folks say they wouldn't live here if it was the last place on earth it honestly doesn't hurt our feelings. This isn't Nashville, we've been told by folks from that neck of the woods that the surounding counties here are a totaly different world. We don't complain about that either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bnhdq1j9Mqk

[d-ray657]

Originally Posted by hillbilly

Well it's clear you have a much different taste in music than us.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6HOniP-sZw

Come on! That was a video by a guy who goes by "IKILLDEMS." Whether it is that name or "IKILLREPS" do you really want to think like someone like that - "If you don't like what your opposition is saying, Kill them." I really want to believe that that's not how you think.

Regards,

D-Ray

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by d-ray657

I live in the Midwest. Even though I work in a city of around 400,000 people, and live in a metropolitan area around a million, I see friendliness all of the time. This comes from people of many nationalities and races. Sometimes, even when people don't seem friendly at first, they respond well to friendliness. People will give you a wave or nod and a smile, they say thank you when you hold a door, or hold a door when you need it.

Not all Muslims are Arab. Not all Arabs are Muslim. Did the store owners announce their religion? Do you know whether, if they were Muslims, they were practicing Muslims? Do you know whether it was their religion that made them unfriendly? Maybe it was a lack of faith that had soured their feelings. Maybe a language barrier made them uncomfortable.

In any event I don't see the logic of drawing conclusions about all Muslim practitioners on the basis of an attitude by a couple of store clerks. Similarly, one can't draw conclusions about all Muslims on the basis of acts of terrorism by a radical group within the Muslim Faith.

There were terrorists in Ireland, but that doesn't translate to all Irishmen. Long ago, the Catholics engaged in murderous crusades, but that doesn't mean that Catholicism is a murderous faith. Just 150 years ago, Americans owned slaves. Jim Jones, who professed to be a Christian, participated in a mass suicide/murder. Different nationalities within Africa have murdered others because of tribal hatred. A Slavic dictator murdered thousands in "ethnic cleansing." The blame for those sins and crimes does not belong to the races or religions or ethnic groups who perpetrated them. They belong to the sick and deranged among those groups who found various ways to manipulate hatred and ignorance.

Unfortunately there are those within this country that want to promote hatred. Too many people accept such vile messages because they don't know the truth, and, thus they are susceptible to the misinformation that promotes the message of hate. Shame on people like Gingrich, the Jewish Defense League, and O'Reilly, who know better, but for one reason or another, find it to their advantage to find ways to divide people. (I didn't include Palin and Beck, because I'm not sure they have the intelligence to know better) I believe America is better than that.

Regards,

D-Ray

Excellent post, Counseler.

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by hillbilly

Well it's clear you have a much different taste in music than us.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6HOniP-sZw



It's a good song and all but the ending of this one is the very best part. When folks say they wouldn't live here if it was the last place on earth it honestly doesn't hurt our feelings. This isn't Nashville, we've been told by folks from that neck of the woods that the surounding counties here are a totaly different world. We don't complain about that either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bnhdq1j9Mqk

You know, I'm originally from the country too. And I have never understood the hayseed mentality, even when I was a hayseed. It's like they revel in being isolated and backward. My hometown is nice to visit once a year, it's always good to see family, but I usually can't wait to leave. Four or five days in that impoverished, rundown, backwoods, jerkwater of a town and I start getting depressed. They're always full of suspicion and mistrust of anything even remotely outside of their pathetic little box. I just can't be that way, I never could. At 17, I joined the Navy because I couldn't wait to leave that shithole and go see the real world. For four years all I did was travel the world. It taught me the most valuable lessons of my life. It taught me that the folks back in Newton Falls truly are clueless, blind and damn proud of it.

I went back once, it lasted three months.

That was 1986, I haven't been back.

If that's heaven to you, you can have it, Hillbilly.

Dave

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by hillbilly

Well it's clear you have a much different taste in music than us.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6HOniP-sZw

OK that does it. Have I forgotten? Have I forgotten?

The yokel singing that song knows nothing about 911 nor do you.

That was my buddy Steve who jumped out that window on 911, that was the escalator I used everyday to get to work and home, those were are my buddies in the rubble searching for survivors, Joe, Mike, Josh... That was my daughter I ran to get out of school after I saw the second plane hit( and not on TV.) Those were my soccer fields that the army took over for a staging area, that was my hockey rink that was set to receive the corpses that day, that was my daughter who watched the towers burning out the back of the car as I speed to the country side just before all the roads were closed down. That is the the statue I saw out my window everyday, that was my neighborhood who had 14 funerals, that was my neighborhood who had the last surviving victim to leave a hospital burn unit YEARS later.

That is my fuckin' city that was attacked, my frckin' country.

So learn to get along with me or fuck off.

No i have not forgotten, unlike the dick head who sings the song I lived it. I did not adapt it to promote my agenda.

you need any clarification?

who is that ass whip who is trying to adapt my countries tragedy for his self promotion anyway?

and yes we have much different taste in music, I like authentic music not manufactured music

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by hillbilly

It's a good song and all but the ending of this one is the very best part. When folks say they wouldn't live here if it was the last place on earth it honestly doesn't hurt our feelings. This isn't Nashville, we've been told by folks from that neck of the woods that the surounding counties here are a totaly different world. We don't complain about that either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bnhdq1j9Mqk

thanks, and here's a link for you

http://fuckthesouth.com/

my advise, get over your persecution complex