The Affordable Care Act

[Oerets]

It's all over now for us all with fracking!! Just a matter of time.




Barney

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

You guys are really something. The "It's So Much Better Now" crowd. Kinda reminds me of back a few years ago when they put my mother on Tarceva for the lung cancer and a few weeks later the oncologist tried to tell us that her cancer was better because she would probably live 4 more months instead of just six weeks.

I have this problem with mercury and coal ash being indiscriminately dumped into one of the most precious fresh water resources on the face of the earth. Maybe I'm all fucked up.

Yes, all of the sudden liberal environmentalists have done a wonderful job of pushing for cleaner air and water. And, don't try to tell me it would have happened anyways and it had nothing to do with environmentalism. Because we're all old enough to remember industry fighting them tooth and nail.

(Or is this going to be another pigheaded case of revisionist history?)

Dave

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

I remember back in the day doing our own brake jobs and being covered in the dust coming out of the brake drums. But it's probably over 40 years since I've done any of that, so hopefully I'm in the clear.

Ike it has been 60 years for me so I guess I'm OK. They x-rayed my lungs last year and did not see anything suspicious.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

You guys are really something. The "It's So Much Better Now" crowd. Kinda reminds me of back a few years ago when they put my mother on Tarceva for the lung cancer and a few weeks later the oncologist tried to tell us that her cancer was better because she would probably live 4 more months instead of just six weeks.

I have this problem with mercury and coal ash being indiscriminately dumped into one of the most precious fresh water resources on the face of the earth. Maybe I'm all fucked up.

I wouldn't say you're all fucked up, but you may be over reacting.

Having never heard of the SS Badger I did a little research, and apparently she is the last large coal fired ship in the United States. She is also a registered historical site. And the owners have already agreed to stop dumping coal ash, which she apparently was allowed to do by the EPA for some time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Badger

She's the last one, and her problems are being addressed. Now this in no way indicates that there aren't further steps which need to be taken concerning pollution, but in the big scheme of things the Badger is a non issue. She won't be around much longer. She truly is the end of an era.

You're getting your wish, and while I can't speak for Pete, do not mistake me for someone who advocates pollution. I share the same goals as you, only I have more patience. And in my humble estimation things are getting much better.

Chas

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by Charles

I wouldn't say you're all fucked up, but you may be over reacting.

Having never heard of the SS Badger I did a little research, and apparently she is the last large coal fired ship in the United States. She is also a registered historical site. And the owners have already agreed to stop dumping coal ash, which she apparently was allowed to do by the EPA for some time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Badger

She's the last one, and her problems are being addressed. Now this in no way indicates that there aren't further steps which need to be taken concerning pollution, but in the big scheme of things the Badger is a non issue. She won't be around much longer. She truly is the end of an era.

You're getting your wish, and while I can't speak for Pete, do not mistake me for someone who advocates pollution. I share the same goals as you, only I have more patience. And in my humble estimation things are getting much better.

Chas

The problem is being addressed...my ass.

She won't be around much longer...yep, today and every day another 4 tons of coal ash are dumped into Lake Michigan. Over-reacting...my ass. Non-issue...my ass. Maybe it's a non-issue for you...it is not for the residents of Wisconsin, Illinois, Indiana and Michigan who have been fighting this disgrace for years. She should have been the end of an era 30 years ago. And Chas...y'know why the Badger is the only one left? Because Lake Michigan is the only Great Lake wholly within US boundaries. There aren't any others because Canada hasn't allowed it in any of the Great Lakes within their purview for years. Icon...my ass. Icon of poison and political bullshit.

The owners of the Badger were ordered to upgrade their system to diesel, natural gas, or any other system outside of coal that would not require the daily dumping of poison into Lake Michigan years ago. And every time they bumped up against the deadline, they appealed to the State of Michigan that it would put them in bankruptcy and cost the Ludington area over a million dollars in related business income and, of course, 100 or so jobs. It's always jobs isn't it. Nothing matters in this country but jobs. The government and politicians and people of Canada long ago recognized that certain things, like potable water, are more important than jobs. So every time the owners began whining about jobs, the State of Michigan went pleading to the EPA, and Michigan Republicans exerted their political muscle in Congress to extend the deadline, and the EPA relented. It's been years now...I'll believe it when I see it.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

The problem is being addressed...my ass.

She won't be around much longer...yep, today and every day another 4 tons of coal ash are dumped into Lake Michigan. Over-reacting...my ass. Non-issue...my ass. Maybe it's a non-issue for you...it is not for the residents of Wisconsin, Illinois, Indiana and Michigan who have been fighting this disgrace for years. She should have been the end of an era 30 years ago. And Chas...y'know why the Badger is the only one left? Because Lake Michigan is the only Great Lake wholly within US boundaries. There aren't any others because Canada hasn't allowed it in any of the Great Lakes within their purview for years. Icon...my ass. Icon of poison and political bullshit.

The owners of the Badger were ordered to upgrade their system to diesel, natural gas, or any other system outside of coal that would not require the daily dumping of poison into Lake Michigan years ago. And every time they bumped up against the deadline, they appealed to the State of Michigan that it would put them in bankruptcy and cost the Ludington area over a million dollars in related business income and, of course, 100 or so jobs. It's always jobs isn't it. Nothing matters in this country but jobs. The government and politicians and people of Canada long ago recognized that certain things, like potable water, are more important than jobs. So every time the owners began whining about jobs, the State of Michigan went pleading to the EPA, and Michigan Republicans exerted their political muscle in Congress to extend the deadline, and the EPA relented. It's been years now...I'll believe it when I see it.

Well, I guess you told me.

Chas

[piece-itpete]

Originally Posted by Charles

... and while I can't speak for Pete, do not mistake me for someone who advocates pollution. I share the same goals as you, only I have more patience. And in my humble estimation things are getting much better.

Chas

Damn good thing you didn't speak for me Chas. Being a person who grew up deep woods camping all over the place, hiking, etc, refusing to use fertilizer and uses resources as long as possible, I obviously love to pollute. Heck I think I'll dump some PCBs in a local ecosystem tonight.

Pete

[merrylander]

Kinda hard to put the top back on a Kentucky mountain and remove that poison from the rivers and streams.

Sure they are slowly getting better but do we have the time, is the damage reversible?

[piece-itpete]

I doubt it, even as we clean up our population keeps growing, still a net increase in pollutants.

Pete

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

I doubt it, even as we clean up our population keeps growing, still a net increase in pollutants.

Pete

And so Mother Nature will protect herslf with bigger and better 'natural disasters'.