Putin Invades the Ukraine

[RickeyM]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

Putin is in a subservient position. The guy who everyone is scared of is Xi.
Xi has almost everything under lock.
For example while the US was involved in countless misadventures Xi took over Africa without firing a shot.

The US is closing down Project Ukraine because it realizes it cannot afford to hand over Russia to China. A great no, no, a bedrock of US geopolitical thought was being violated and the disaster amplified by the tremendous technological , scientific achievement of the Chinese people. An ascendant China buttressed with the vast area of Russia, a country with 11time zones! WTF. Furthermore
Ukraine is not strategically important...Poland and Romania
already fulfill such roll in that geographical area.

US is belatedly trying to take back US from China.
Putin is a distraction, Xi is the man.

Yeah, sure. tRump is trying to hand over Ukraine to Russia because Putin wants Ukranian territory on his march to Western Europe. China is an economic powerhouse. They aren't seeking to go to war with anyone. They're expanding their influence around the globe and idiot isolationists in America are making it easy for them. China's not going waste resources trying to "fix" Russia.

[Dondilion]

Originally Posted by RickeyM

Yeah, sure. tRump is trying to hand over Ukraine to Russia because Putin wants Ukranian territory on his march to Western Europe. China is an economic powerhouse. They aren't seeking to go to war with anyone. They're expanding their influence around the globe and idiot isolationists in America are making it easy for them. China's not going waste resources trying to "fix" Russia.

What march? Look how long it took Russia just to hold onto Eastern Ukraine. Russia does not have the equipment or manpower to do any march. BTW there is a very powerful Polish outfit in Europe.
China is not interested in fixing Russia. What China is interesting in is getting the vast resources of Russia at bargain price. The present situation works for China.

[Oerets]

With the up coming years this period may well be the transition of power to China. Russia and the US need to be friends. The enemy of my enemy is my friend is an old saying for good reason. But at what cost to all the tested and proven long term friends of the US along with our citizens at home. Make deals with Putin hurting true friends seem like a DK move.

Yet much like Afghanistan and Trump's first term Ukraine seems to be soon sold out.....

[RickeyM]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

What march? Look how long it took Russia just to hold onto Eastern Ukraine. Russia does not have the equipment or manpower to do any march. BTW there is a very powerful Polish outfit in Europe.
China is not interested in fixing Russia. What China is interesting in is getting the vast resources of Russia at bargain price. The present situation works for China.

So Putin is just going to stop with Ukraine. I bet you thought he was going to stop with Crimea too. If Russia wants to capitalize on its "vast resources" then Russia needs to find markets for them to get the rubles it wants. Nobody told them to be the agressor and invade Ukraine.

[Human]

Originally Posted by RickeyM

So Putin is just going to stop with Ukraine. I bet you thought he was going to stop with Crimea too.

A few additions to that list would be Georgia, Transnistria, Chechnia, Abkhazian, and Moldova.

Cue Dondilion to chime in why all those actions were just Russia trying to defend itself or some crap

[Noogies]

Originally Posted by RickeyM

So Putin is just going to stop with Ukraine. I bet you thought he was going to stop with Crimea too. If Russia wants to capitalize on its "vast resources" then Russia needs to find markets for them to get the rubles it wants. Nobody told them to be the aggressor and invade Ukraine.

Can't think of his name right now but wasn't there another guy who was going to stop after Poland?

[Dondilion]

All the above is neither here nor there. Whether Russia wants to march - yes or no - it does not have the capability.

The Ukraine war exposed tremendous weakness in the Russian arm forces. The Surovikin line saved Russia from catastrophy, gave it time to catch its breath, reorganize and establish a credible reserve. That is - now Russia has to look to its defense and eschew offense.

The Americans know that, the Russians know that. The Americans got what they wanted...
(1)to wean Europe off Russian energy so that the Europeans would have to buy American energy at inflated price, and the associated benefit where Europe becomes less competitive forcing the Europeans to open energy sensitive manufacturing in America. There is a saying which relates to Germany in particular.
Keep
US in
Russia out
And Germany down.

(2)Russian bleeding.

Now there comes a point where there is a bigger strategic picture for the Americans and that is China. China is galloping away. Biden tried his bit especially trying to deny China high valued semi conductors and the imposition of big tariffs on China's star performers.

Trump admin is returning to the American cherished model of trying to keep Russia and China apart. Ukraine is therefore a casualty. it is no longer of import in the greater picture. General Milley saw this coming and tried to relay this to Zelensky. The formidable and popular Ukrainian General Zalushny saw this coming also but he was pushed aside with the help of Mrs Kagan.

I suspect what the Trump admin is going to do now is call for an audit. Wow! wow! wow!

[bobabode]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

All the above is neither here nor there. Whether Russia wants to march - yes or no - it does not have the capability.

The Ukraine war exposed tremendous weakness in the Russian arm forces. The Surovikin line saved Russia from catastrophy, gave it time to catch its breath, reorganize and establish a credible reserve. That is - now Russia has to look to its defense and eschew offense.

The Americans know that, the Russians know that. The Americans got what they wanted...
(1)to wean Europe off Russian energy so that the Europeans would have to buy American energy at inflated price, and the associated benefit where Europe becomes less competitive forcing the Europeans to open energy sensitive manufacturing in America. There is a saying which relates to Germany in particular.
Keep
US in
Russia out
And Germany down.

(2)Russian bleeding.

Now there comes a point where there is a bigger strategic picture for the Americans and that is China. China is galloping away. Biden tried his bit especially trying to deny China high valued semi conductors and the imposition of big tariffs on China's star performers.

Trump admin is returning to the American cherished model of trying to keep Russia and China apart. Ukraine is therefore a casualty. it is no longer of import in the greater picture. General Milley saw this coming and tried to relay this to Zelensky. The formidable and popular Ukrainian General Zalushny saw this coming also but he was pushed aside with the help of Mrs Kagan.

I suspect what the Trump admin is going to do now is call for an audit. Wow! wow! wow!

What is that shit you've been smoking, Ace?

[RickeyM]

Originally Posted by bobabode

What is that shit you've been smoking, Ace?

I think it is more of a case of hypoxemia. In his universe Putin is just looking out for Russia's sovernignty.

[Oasis]

America was 'America First' isolationist at the beginning of WWll, and what happened? They were attacked, and only by luck were able to continue after it, if those carriers were docked that morning America would have been out for the count.

An isolated America is a weaker America, and Trump is doing well to isolate America.