Thirty Years On, How Well Do Global Warming Predictions Stand Up?

[Mark B]

Originally Posted by finnbow

So, the wingnut argument concerning global warming is as follows:

1. Global warming is a hoax (a Chinese hoax per your Dear Leader), so we should do nothing about it.

2. Since we haven't done enough about it in the past, it's too late to do anything now or in the future.

And you wonder why I call many of your arguments bad faith.

Calling it bad faith is being kind to the troll.

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

So, the wingnut argument concerning global warming is as follows:

1. Global warming is a hoax (a Chinese hoax per your Dear Leader), so we should do nothing about it.

2. Since we haven't done enough about it in the past, it's too late to do anything now or in the future.

And you wonder why I call many of your arguments bad faith.

Caution, straw man construction zone.

You do this all the time, Finn, and then you suggest my arguments are in bad faith.

1) I never said global warming is a hoax. Never. I have said that I'm skeptical that man has the ability to impact the environment this much. I'm also skeptical about the "consensus" claims. Science is about theory and proof, and skepticism and expanding knowledge. It's not about "consensus" and demonizing those who disagree with the "consensus".

Hell, you call yourselves progressives, yet you want to claim that the "debate is over" and silence those who disagree. That's the stuff the Church used to do in the dark ages. And while progressives don't burn those who disagree with the consensus at the stake like the Church used to do, you're not above destroying people's careers or labeling folks as "deniers" (the latter likely inspired by the sackcloth and ash garb forced on heretics).

2) You're easily confused, I guess. No, that's not a "wingnut" or conservative argument. These are the claims of the article that I posted from well-credentialled gov't climate scientists.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

Caution, straw man construction zone.

You do this all the time, Finn, and then you suggest my arguments are in bad faith.

1) I never said global warming is a hoax. Never. I have said that I'm skeptical that man has the ability to impact the environment this much. I'm also skeptical about the "consensus" claims. Science is about theory and proof, and skepticism and expanding knowledge. It's not about "consensus" and demonizing those who disagree with the "consensus".

Hell, you call yourselves progressives…

Two things - My post did not say you called it a hoax. I said wingnuts did. By the transitive property, you have now identified yourself as a wingnut. Congrats.

I have never here (or anywhere else) called myself a progressive. I am more of what one would call a Never Trumper (and former Republican, BTW). Dubya and Trump cured me of that affliction.

[Oerets]

For the sake of discussion. Even if you are still convinced that man had little hand in the planet's climate warming up.

Yet still experiencing along the rest of us Earthlings current events. Must be missing this important fact. We have nowhere else to go. With predictions of extreme heat events and vast areas uninhabitable. Oceans rising coral die offs forest fires flooding droughts ......

It seems even the most ardent of the nonbelievers would still think some actions are needed. To do something not keep whistling pass the grave yard thinking or more to the point selfishly ignoring the dangers.

Do something, start here in the developed countries. For we are the culprits, our finger prints are all over this event. Most of the migration from the Equator, North Africa for heat and Island Nations is a result of ocean rising. Added along with more frequent stronger storms.

Climate scientist are working over time figuring out the means to tackle the problem. They need the help of everyone to make it work.

Will they get it?

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Two things - My post did not say you called it a hoax. I said wingnuts did. By the transitive property, you have now identified yourself as a wingnut. Congrats.

Dude, you've called me any number of things, including a wingnut, that you've apparently lost track of them all. You name-call as a way of maintaining your straw man arguments. That way, you don't have an argument with an actual person. You can have the argument with who you want that person to be for argument's sake. Here's just one example from a recent post:

Originally Posted by finnbow

You Trumpkins are simply immune to facts and logic and incapable of admitting (or even recognizing) that you have been conned by a pathological liar and career criminal.

Originally Posted by finnbow

I have never here (or anywhere else) called myself a progressive. I am more of what one would call a Never Trumper (and former Republican, BTW). Dubya and Trump cured me of that affliction.

If you're a former Republican, you can't be a never-Trumper. Never-Trumpers are Republicans who want to purge the party of all things Trump. Your posts here have left me with the strong impression that you have far more in common with the left. Your approach is typically to post about what you're against, but I'll be damned if I know what you're for.

[whell]

Originally Posted by Oerets

For the sake of discussion. Even if you are still convinced that man had little hand in the planet's climate warming up.

Yet still experiencing along the rest of us Earthlings current events. Must be missing this important fact. We have nowhere else to go. With predictions of extreme heat events and vast areas uninhabitable. Oceans rising coral die offs forest fires flooding droughts ......

It seems even the most ardent of the nonbelievers would still think some actions are needed. To do something not keep whistling pass the grave yard thinking or more to the point selfishly ignoring the dangers.

Do something, start here in the developed countries. For we are the culprits, our finger prints are all over this event. Most of the migration from the Equator, North Africa for heat and Island Nations is a result of ocean rising. Added along with more frequent stronger storms.

Climate scientist are working over time figuring out the means to tackle the problem. They need the help of everyone to make it work.

Will they get it?

To do "something".....What is that "something" that we need to do?

Common sense would suggest that conclusively diagnosing a problem is required before attempting a repair. Consensus isn't diagnostics, nor is it part of the scientific method.

And yes, we're all experiencing current events. However, concluding that current events must be caused by us, on a planet where average temperatures have risen and fallen for billions of years, could also be an influence of recency bias.

[donquixote99]

Originally Posted by whell

To do "something".....What is that "something" that we need to do?

Common sense would suggest that conclusively diagnosing a problem is required before attempting a repair. Consensus isn't diagnostics, nor is it part of the scientific method.

And yes, we're all experiencing current events. However, concluding that current events must be caused by us, on a planet where average temperatures have risen and fallen for billions of years, could also be an influence of recency bias.

Demand 5 nines of certainty. You will never get it, so you will win the argument! The planet will go to hell, but that's not important....

[bobabode]

Originally Posted by whell

Dude, you've called me any number of things, including a wingnut, that you've apparently lost track of them all. You name-call as a way of maintaining your straw man arguments. That way, you don't have an argument with an actual person. You can have the argument with who you want that person to be for argument's sake. Here's just one example from a recent post:





If you're a former Republican, you can't be a never-Trumper. Never-Trumpers are Republicans who want to purge the party of all things Trump. Your posts here have left me with the strong impression that you have far more in common with the left. Your approach is typically to post about what you're against, but I'll be damned if I know what you're for.

OMG, he called you a "Trumpkin"? Heavens to Betsy.
You really are a hysterical card, Mike. How will you survive?

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

If you're a former Republican, you can't be a never-Trumper. Never-Trumpers are Republicans who want to purge the party of all things Trump. Your posts here have left me with the strong impression that you have far more in common with the left. Your approach is typically to post about what you're against, but I'll be damned if I know what you're for.

I'm a raging moderate who believes that the GOP has to be destroyed root and branch as it has become a proto-fascist personality cult. My take on most issues is somewhere between center-left and center-right, though the center-right has been killed off in the GOP and there's nobody left in Congress to champion that ideology. Hell, the GOP couldn't even come up with a party platform that went beyond cringe-worthy Trump fealty.

I'll find common cause with anybody who believes Trump (and Trumpism) is a malignant, corrupt and dangerous presence that must be expunged permanently from the body politic and oppose anyone who doesn't. Every other issue is secondary. It's as simple as that.

[Chicks]

Originally Posted by whell

To do "something".....What is that "something" that we need to do?

We need to put Trump behind bars, for starters. If you're not a Trumpkin, you must surely agree, right?