10% U.S. Flat Tax Accross the Board!

[kretinus]

Originally Posted by soundhound

where? some third world country?

Do you get out much? Seriously.

$24K after taxes would be roughly around $19K a year.

That comes to $1583 a month. In my area, a decent 1 bedroon apartment will run you around $400 and that will generally include heat and water, our electric bill with 2 PCs a variety of electronics and tons of outdoor lighting runs around $100 so let's say $500 total for housing and utilities.

That would be in a town with a theatre, a really nice water park, tons of other tree filled parks, more than a few night clubs etc. Yeah, third world level living.

OK so then you have a little over $1000 a month in discretionary money. Car payment? yeah if you need something to impress the neighbors, that will cost you. But you can get safe, reliable transportation for a loan with payments of under $200 a month. If you haven't trashed your credit rating with credit cards buying shiny objects.

OK $800 left. Insurance, if you're a good safe driver will run you around $40 for state minimum liability, around $125 for the works. So let's say $125, $675 left.

Health insurance? I can get my own policy right now, standard 80/20 with prescription for about $150 a month or less, so you have $525 left.

Are you seeing a patterm here or do you want to insist that you can't live anywhere but a third world country on $24K a year.

Now if you have a family, yes, $24K would be pathetic.

Then we split into two groups, families that ended up with $24K a year after someone lost a job or got hurt. I'm all for helping them find a way out of that hole.

And then you have the people who knew they only had $24K a year and decided it owuld be cool to have kids even though they couldn't afford them.

How far do you go in supporting people who simply didn't use common sense?

Or do you think we have a right to a standard of living regardless of our choices at the tax payers expense?

[wintermuted]

Originally Posted by kretinus

I applaud you for bringing a new level of sophistication to the field of trolling.

Pot, kettle, black, sir, but anyway...

Your anti-intellectualism is the lens through which you see politics.

I know you're not stupid, kretinous. It's just that your basic premise is flawed. Every discovery ever made, every technological leap ever accomplished, every progressive governmental move since the days of "I have a large club, ergo what's yours is mine" has been due to thinking individuals considering problems in creative new ways - looking for multiple solutions, even if they're complicated.

The place you seem to be coming from scares the living crap out of me. If everyone believed as you do, we'd all still be in the stone ages.

[kretinus]

let me know when you can form an actual constructive argument.

[soundhound]

Originally Posted by kretinus

Do you get out much? Seriously.

$24K after taxes would be roughly around $19K a year.

That comes to $1583 a month. In my area, a decent 1 bedroon apartment will run you around $400 and that will generally include heat and water, our electric bill with 2 PCs a variety of electronics and tons of outdoor lighting runs around $100 so let's say $500 total for housing and utilities.

That would be in a town with a theatre, a really nice water park, tons of other tree filled parks, more than a few night clubs etc. Yeah, third world level living.

OK so then you have a little over $1000 a month in discretionary money. Car payment? yeah if you need something to impress the neighbors, that will cost you. But you can get safe, reliable transportation for a loan with payments of under $200 a month. If you haven't trashed your credit rating with credit cards buying shiny objects.

OK $800 left. Insurance, if you're a good safe driver will run you around $40 for state minimum liability, around $125 for the works. So let's say $125, $675 left.

Health insurance? I can get my own policy right now, standard 80/20 with prescription for about $150 a month or less, so you have $525 left.

Are you seeing a patterm here or do you want to insist that you can't live anywhere but a third world country on $24K a year.

your math seems quite convincing, however you left out a considerable number of expenses, among which include food, clothing, gasoline and maintenance for the compact car, the 20% plus deductible for health care, toiletries, etc. etc. ad infinitum. not to mention a few luxuries such as the occasional cost of a theatre ticket or a beer at the local tavern. i'm not arguing that a person can't live on $24k a year, i lived on about half that for a lot of my working life. however, there's no way in hell i would say that i was happy with my economic condition. nor would i say that my standard of living was acceptable, especially compared to that of the people who profitted off my labor. and i certainly never asked anyone to support me. i've never drawn unemployment or welfare. but i damned sure didn't feel like i should have paid more in taxes that the millionaires. and i did!

i now earn approximately $34,000 a year. i am single, have no dependents, and other than some student loans, have no debt. while i am able to afford rent on a two bedroom house, have cable, internet, phone, and can buy a piece or two of stereo gear now and then, i would certainly not call my standard of living high. while it is far better than that of many other people, it is certainly not nearly as good as that of many others.

with a 10% tax, my yearly federal income tax would not change a lot, however, i don't only think of myself. i also consider those that are less fortunate than i am, as well as those who have everything, but never worked a day in their life.

[kretinus]

I lived for years just above minimum wage no problems dude, I guess it all depends on what kind of lifestyle you think you need to be happy.

But I do know some very happy families making about as much as you and i don't hear them complaining.

I was kinda hoping all this mess would slap people around and make them finally realize what's really important and forget the bling contest for awhile but it's obvious it hasn't.

I have no problems helping people, but having worked as a volunteer for several organizations, I also know that there's a genuine danger of creating dependence and when that happens, the people you think you're helping just stop evolving.

Sometimes if you want more, you need to work more, and if it seems like too much of a sacrifice then maybe you don't need it.


But it's been enjoyable the short time I was here, most of you have an interest in civil discourse, I just don't expect it to last and I have a desire to simply avoid such things anymore.

See ya on AK now and then and thanks for the debate, I enjoyed it.

[Ozmoid]

Originally Posted by spok

I would be in favor of a flat tax but the word I hear is that 10% would not be enough. It would most likely be in the range of 14-17%

Flat Tax, 10%, not a penny more. Let the government figure out how to operate on our budget, not their own! And let's get it down to 5% over the next five years, please.

[simi]

:drool:

$400 a month rent... In DC an effeciancy with less than 1000 sqft can easily reach $1500 on a bad day...

Guess I need to get out less....

[Ozmoid]

Originally Posted by simi

:drool:

$400 a month rent... In DC an effeciancy with less than 1000 sqft can easily reach $1500 on a bad day...

Guess I need to get out less....

Come live with me for a month... you'll have a whole new perspective!

[simi]

Wish I could.. always looking for a change in life... Wish I could just afford to travel, meet people, and never grow a root...

[EchoWars]

The last time I paid $400 a month rent was over 25 years ago. Three times that amount is more like it.

In the 80's, I was making about the amount you are bantering about, with a wife and kid. We scraped by, barely. Every purchase had to be carefully weighed. And managing to save enough to afford a down for our own house was a bleedin' pipe dream.

$24K? Yeah...break out the 40 year-old single malt and Cuban cigars.