West Coast ports facing shutdown in labor dispute

[sheltiedave]

There is no harm in blue collar workers becoming wealthy, as the owners of these shipping and transportation companies have succeeded in doing so.

Many of these longshoremen have a vast bank of technical skills that enable them to complete their job safely, efficiently, and in timely fashion.There are not too many people who can run overhead shiploading cranes, rig chain and wire rope lines, understand where to set transmodals, and do it all safely, while at great personal risk to all involved.

These four stick rigs are no picnic; neither is clambering all over transmodals in every kind of weather, twelve hours a day. Throw in continuous overhead work, working at heights, working in continuous pinchpoints, working with entanglement hazards, handling hazardous materials, and working with shifting heavy loads meet almost ALL of the special pay provisions that unions have.

Just like working as a union painter on the Golden Gate Bridge, there are very few folks eager to work these jobs,.

[donquixote99]

Originally Posted by bobabode

Good description of the owner class.

Natch. I said 'people,' meaning everyone. It's just most obvious with the owners, because they are most of the ones with enough power to grab big bunches.

[donquixote99]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

Lord knows I would.

Look at all of these Democrats, suddenly opposed to labor, now that they see these guys make more money than they do. (AFAIK)

Time to dust off your Reagan fanboy paraphernalia and show your true stripes, Boys.

Dave

I try to look at things as they actually are, without partisan goggles. Sure, that makes me a Reagan fanboy.

Sheltie makes a good case for premium pay for actual cargo handlers. Now can I get a job description for the 'clerks?' Isn't high pay for them basically a move to limit job loss to automation?

[Tom Joad]

Originally Posted by sheltiedave

There is no harm in blue collar workers becoming wealthy, as the owners of these shipping and transportation companies have succeeded in doing so.

Many of these longshoremen have a vast bank of technical skills that enable them to complete their job safely, efficiently, and in timely fashion.There are not too many people who can run overhead shiploading cranes, rig chain and wire rope lines, understand where to set transmodals, and do it all safely, while at great personal risk to all involved.

These four stick rigs are no picnic; neither is clambering all over transmodals in every kind of weather, twelve hours a day. Throw in continuous overhead work, working at heights, working in continuous pinchpoints, working with entanglement hazards, handling hazardous materials, and working with shifting heavy loads meet almost ALL of the special pay provisions that unions have.

Just like working as a union painter on the Golden Gate Bridge, there are very few folks eager to work these jobs,.

I don't have a problem with what they are being paid. I just wondered why they feel they need to strike?

If there are legitimate safety issues shouldn't OSHA be taking care of that?

[sheltiedave]

OSHA cannot take care of the inherent dangers.

OSHA also has no control over the slippage, which is what occurs when management wants workers to start cutting corners, and accepting a higher level of risk, by driving production higher and higher. This is such a high risk job that a tremendous amount of time motion studies have been conducted, and everyone involved, from the shipbound longshoremen, the pickers, setters, swingers, spotters, logistics, and clerks all have a specific range of production they have to hit every day. More production either means more hours, or reducing time spent setting up every critical lift.

Management wants slippage to trend up, union folks want the status quo with more hazard pay, the fleet just wants to get offloaded with minimal dead wait time so they can go run another cycle. And management wants to automate as much as possible, so they don't have to pay anyone money, which represents an uncontrolled variant cost.

These clerks and longshoremen are rock stars, and they get paid accordingly. I have seen work schedulers at nuclear fuel production plants paid on a similar scale. When you have an entire industry that depends on you getting things right, every single hour and every single day, you become a rainman.

[VanishingPoi]

Originally Posted by bobabode

You go girl!!! I've been watching this too. Management could care less about safety and/or sharing the wealth during the boom times.

They think that money is meaningful in California. They don't live here. Hell, on the money I make here, I could live in a luxurious home where they live. As it stands, I pay $1,800 a month for a small one bedroom apt. That is just for the space. I have to rent a frig and pay ungodly amounts for utilities. I almost forgot, I am also forced to pay renters insurance separately.

Shit, my 20 year old daughter has cancer and undergoing chemo as we speak and I can't even help here much financially. It is fucking unreal. She also goes to school and works a part time. Luckily, she lives in Oregon and because she is in college, she has good health benefits.

They deserve every wage they get and more. It is those fuckers who don't work and make there money by doing nothing and they do not pay taxes on it. The job those folks do is so dangerous. I know. My uncle was a ship mechanic. He flew parts out to stranded ships and worked on them. He was seriously hurt multiple times.

Yup, I'm whining to the fuck who told me I was whining.

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

I try to look at things as they actually are, without partisan goggles. Sure, that makes me a Reagan fanboy.

Sheltie makes a good case for premium pay for actual cargo handlers. Now can I get a job description for the 'clerks?' Isn't high pay for them basically a move to limit job loss to automation?

Maybe so. I don't know and neither do you. So, let's dispense with the jumpy conclusions, shall we?

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by sheltiedave

OSHA cannot take care of the inherent dangers.

OSHA also has no control over the slippage, which is what occurs when management wants workers to start cutting corners, and accepting a higher level of risk, by driving production higher and higher. This is such a high risk job that a tremendous amount of time motion studies have been conducted, and everyone involved, from the shipbound longshoremen, the pickers, setters, swingers, spotters, logistics, and clerks all have a specific range of production they have to hit every day. More production either means more hours, or reducing time spent setting up every critical lift.

Management wants slippage to trend up, union folks want the status quo with more hazard pay, the fleet just wants to get offloaded with minimal dead wait time so they can go run another cycle. And management wants to automate as much as possible, so they don't have to pay anyone money, which represents an uncontrolled variant cost.

These clerks and longshoremen are rock stars, and they get paid accordingly. I have seen work schedulers at nuclear fuel production plants paid on a similar scale. When you have an entire industry that depends on you getting things right, every single hour and every single day, you become a rainman.

Excellent post.

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by VanishingPoi

They think that money is meaningful in California. They don't live here. Hell, on the money I make here, I could live in a luxurious home where they live. As it stands, I pay $1,800 a month for a small one bedroom apt. That is just for the space. I have to rent a frig and pay ungodly amounts for utilities. I almost forgot, I am also forced to pay renters insurance separately.

Shit, my 20 year old daughter has cancer and undergoing chemo as we speak and I can't even help here much financially. It is fucking unreal. She also goes to school and works a part time. Luckily, she lives in Oregon and because she is in college, she has good health benefits.

They deserve every wage they get and more. It is those fuckers who don't work and make there money by doing nothing and they do not pay taxes on it. The job those folks do is so dangerous. I know. My uncle was a ship mechanic. He flew parts out to stranded ships and worked on them. He was seriously hurt multiple times.

Yup, I'm whining to the fuck who told me I was whining.

You wouldn't be referring to the 1%ers, would you?

Dave

[VanishingPoi]

Originally Posted by sheltiedave

OSHA cannot take care of the inherent dangers.

OSHA also has no control over the slippage, which is what occurs when management wants workers to start cutting corners, and accepting a higher level of risk, by driving production higher and higher. This is such a high risk job that a tremendous amount of time motion studies have been conducted, and everyone involved, from the shipbound longshoremen, the pickers, setters, swingers, spotters, logistics, and clerks all have a specific range of production they have to hit every day. More production either means more hours, or reducing time spent setting up every critical lift.

Management wants slippage to trend up, union folks want the status quo with more hazard pay, the fleet just wants to get offloaded with minimal dead wait time so they can go run another cycle. And management wants to automate as much as possible, so they don't have to pay anyone money, which represents an uncontrolled variant cost.

These clerks and longshoremen are rock stars, and they get paid accordingly. I have seen work schedulers at nuclear fuel production plants paid on a similar scale. When you have an entire industry that depends on you getting things right, every single hour and every single day, you become a rainman.

I agree with Bluestreak. Excellent post.