Shots Fired at The Capitol? - Page 6

barbara · #51 10-05-2013, 05:47 AM

It's a blessing the child was not physically injured.

JJIII · #52 10-05-2013, 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeke

Yes, a .357 Magnum will penetrate an engine block but we're talking perfect conditions and "penetrate" is not the same definition as "disable," let alone immediately disable.

Sum? That idea is a non-starter from jump.

As for shooting the tires out, someone has been watching way too many movies. First, again, that does not disable the car. Second, even if standing there, do you have any idea how difficult it is to hit anything, let alone a moving target, with a handgun under stress?

"Accuracy" in such situations is considered within an 8.5 x 11-inch sheet of paper at 6-10 feet on a stationary target. (No, I am not kidding.) The sidewall of a tire is 3-4 inches, moving at a high rate, and must be struck at an angle that punctures.

Sum? That's not only a non-starter, it's a pipe dream.

You're in a public place, the driver is erratic and has already met the standard for her vehicle being used as a deadly weapon. She's been nuts at the White House and the Capitol? The training in this situation is stop the car.

I shoot her.

I may have nightmares for decades but this is my job.

I shoot her.

Quote:

Originally Posted by barbara

It's a blessing the child was not physically injured.

Yes to both posts.

merrylander · #53 10-05-2013, 06:53 AM

17 shots were fired, 7 at the departing vehicle as it sped off 10 more after it had rsammed the barrier and was no longer moving. Plus the woman was already known to have mental problems but was not hospitalized and was still in charge of her one year old daughter.

donquixote99 · #54 10-05-2013, 08:20 AM

Given the ultra-high value of the targets she started at and finished at, she picked the wrong place to be nuts. It's tragic, but after once breaking away with the vehicle from a cordon of agents trying to arrest her, she was out of chances. Shooting justified.

HarmanKardon · #55 10-05-2013, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donquixote99

Given the ultra-high value of the targets she started at and finished at, she picked the wrong place to be nuts. It's tragic, but after once breaking away with the vehicle from a cordon of agents trying to arrest her, she was out of chances. Shooting justified.

Objection Sir.

Edit: There should have been a way for so much officers to stop the car by shooting, not the driver. The shooting of the driver was not justified. Stop the nuts, don't kill them - this is the more European attitude.

BlueStreak · #56 10-05-2013, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

It is a sad story.

If a person is trying to run over a cop they have every right to shoot to kill.

Pete

Even a Cleveland cop? I thought you hated cops. Aren't they government goons?

Dave

BlueStreak · #57 10-05-2013, 08:37 AM

It looks to me like the police did put themselves in potential danger making efforts to stop her without shooting her. I see them approaching the vehicle, weapons drawn but not firing, and trying to open the door. It seems she had the opportunity to surrender right there. But, instead she backed up into them, turned and nearly hit another one as she zoomed off.

I would have shot her too.

Dave

JJIII · #58 10-05-2013, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarmanKardon

Objection Sir.

Edit: There should have been a way for so much officers to stop the car by shooting, not the driver. The shooting of the driver was not justified. Stop the nuts, don't kill them - this is the more European attitude.

Do you have any ideas as to how that could have been accomplished?

donquixote99 · #59 10-05-2013, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarmanKardon

Objection Sir.

Edit: There should have been a way for so much officers to stop the car by shooting, not the driver. The shooting of the driver was not justified. Stop the nuts, don't kill them - this is the more European attitude.

Except they had no way to know she was an unarmed insane person (unarmed except for the vehicle), and her behavior was also consistent with a very dangerous attacker. 'Stopping the car' is chancy and difficult, and might leave you with an armed and dangerous terrorist on foot. Stopping the driver was what they had to do.

It is good that they didn't saturate the car with bullets and kill the child.

I agree they might have made a second try to arrest her when she came to a stop at the Capitol, except it's the Capitol, and what they'd seen already was extreme unwillingness to submit to arrest, and instead assaults on officers with the vehicle. Like I said, she picked the wrong place to be insane.

HarmanKardon · #60 10-05-2013, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJIII

Do you have any ideas as to how that could have been accomplished?

Oh my God - it is THAT simple. Shoot the left and the right front wheel - not just the tires - into pieces and the vehicle is not capable to move anymore.

I my opinion this woman got apruptly into panic, for what mental reason ever, a loud crying baby behind her. Certainly she had mental problems but this is no reason to shoot her. Now you guys say, it was not visible who was in the car, how much danger could probably have been in that car. This is absolutely correct - but if the car cannot move anymore and it is surrounded by hundreds of police officers you got any any time you need to get the person out of the car, you just have to wait in a safe distance. A baby lost his mother.

Americans love to shoot Americans - and 7,5 billion Non-Americans do not understand this. Sorry for this sarcasm. It is just because I love this country anyway, each of my posts in this forum is a confession of this sentiment for this country.