Christian Nation?

[BlueStreak]

Well, I was going to upload a file of Jeffersons comments on the subject from the VA dept. of Education, but it keeps coming up "Invalid file".

You can find it by going to Google and searching "Jeffersons thoughts on Politics and Religion"---a fascinating read.

It really helped me to understand how one can at once hold Christian beliefs, but support "Separation of Church and State".

As I recall; "The wall of separation must remain high and impenetrable."
Also, "I know of no free nation, ridden with priests."--T.J.
(These are from memory, so bear that in mind.)


Regards,

Dave

[merrylander]

ROTFLMAO

A christian nation? Best one I have heard all day.

Jesus said ". . .and the second is like unto it, thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."

Maybe I can get them to point the Hubble down here to see if it can observe much of this neighbourly loving, unless maybe it is his neighbour's wife.

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

That is somewhat true today, but less true than it was years ago. In a few more years the revision of history will be complete and Paul Revere will have displayed his "one if by land, two if by sea" lanterns in the bell tower of the First Baptist church.

I've also heard it explained that the nation was founded by "Puritans" who came here seeking "religious freedom".
It would be more accurate to say that the Puritans were EXPELLED from Europe because of the extreme and abusive methods they used in the practice of their religion, and the founding fathers feared the establishment of a state religion would lead to the same type of abuses. Makes perfectly good sense to me. Look at the type of society the "Puritans" set-up when they got here............but, I'm sure THAT is all a big lie now, as well.

Regards,
Dave

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by merrylander

ROTFLMAO

A christian nation? Best one I have heard all day.

Jesus said ". . .and the second is like unto it, thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."

Maybe I can get them to point the Hubble down here to see if it can observe much of this neighbourly loving, unless maybe it is his neighbour's wife.

True,

I wonder what Jesus would have to say about denying people healthcare---because we think they didn't do anything to deserve it?

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Go read "Jeffersons thoughts on Politics and Religion", Rob. It'll make your day.

Dave

[piece-itpete]

Originally Posted by epifanatic

This is a sample of what the founding fathers thought about Christianity.
Benjamin Franklin: "I wish it (Christianity) were more productive of good works ... I mean real good works ... not holy-day keeping, sermon-hearing ... or making long prayers, filled with flatteries and compliments despised by wise men, and much less capable of pleasing the Deity."
"Lighthouses are more helpful than churches."
John Adams: "The divinity of Jesus is made a convenient cover for absurdity."
James Madison: "During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry, and persecution."
"Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise."
Thomas Jefferson: "There is not one redeeming feature in our superstition of Christianity. It has made one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites."
"Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burned, tortured, fined, and imprisoned, yet we have not advanced one inch toward uniformity.”
"Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man."

Outside of Jefferson, who btw considered the Federal Government FORIEGN (good luck SS let alone healthcare) and would've supported the teabaggers, those talk about ORGANIZED religion, not Christianity itself.

There was a good reason they wanted this:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

it's the same reason it's together with free speech and free press - government control of religion interferes with free expression.

Originally Posted by merrylander

ROTFLMAO

A christian nation? Best one I have heard all day.

Jesus said ". . .and the second is like unto it, thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."

Maybe I can get them to point the Hubble down here to see if it can observe much of this neighbourly loving, unless maybe it is his neighbour's wife.

Very sad and very true. I'm afraid it was always thus.

Who's the new guy?

Pete

[piece-itpete]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

...
It would be more accurate to say that the Puritans were EXPELLED from Europe because of the extreme and abusive methods they used in the practice of their religion, and the founding fathers feared the establishment of a state religion would lead to the same type of abuses. ...

Um, no. They were often burned at the stake and left to live in peace.

When one of the Puritans controlled England (Cromwell) those practices largely stopped and England became one of the most tolerant countries in Europe.

Pete

[merrylander]

Whut????

[Boreas]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

True,

I wonder what Jesus would have to say about denying people healthcare---because we think they didn't do anything to deserve it?

Dave

Why, didn't you know? Jesus refused to perform his miracle cures for people with pre-existing conditions or who had reached their lifetime limit for miracles.

John

[Boreas]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

it's the same reason it's together with free speech and free press - government control of religion interferes with free expression.

There are two sides to that coin. Madison's primary concern was that government would exert undue influence on religion and bend it to its purposes. Jefferson's concern was the exact opposite. The truth, as fr as I'm concerned, is that there is an equal danger of both.

John