Facebook IPO - Lessons learned?
 

I'm curious what my friends on the left side of this forum think about the events surrounding the Facebook IPO. Here's a firm that where the number 1 and number 2 ranking officers - Zuckerberg and Sandberg, who now have net worth in excess of $15B and $5B respectively - are certainly Dems and lean left.

Yet the IPO has made them billionaires, and had been fraught with allegations of, at best, overvaluation of stock, to at worst insider trading and mis-communicated changes to the valuation of the stock within days of the IPO. CBS News called the IPO 'drenched in arrogance' as the stock was overvalued and over-hyped from the start, and the insiders fed and fueled the hype.

Now, I suspect that if this were a company owned and abetted by the political right, some folks on this forum would be chomping at the bit to post how the Wall Streeters are getting their "comeuppance" and how greedy the right leaning owners must have been. Does that same characterization apply to this IPO, and this company, and these newly minted lefty billionaires?

I also suspect our mainstream media - those who cover the finance / investing world - are a bit complicit here as well. I think many were caught up in Zuckerberg's celebrity rather than doing any objective analysis of Facebook's finances.

Good post!



Borrowing from a Merrylander post....

http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/...NEW091211A.htm

There seems to be a double standard with where the wealth was acquired. If you are Oprah...a rock star, Michael Jordan, or made your millions as a box office star...the disparate is NOT!? :rolleyes:

Take that and this

Ain't that great, and that was with depositors money too. I hears on the radio that indeed the gov would bail them out too because of deregulation.

And now Greece seriously looking to default.

Gonna be an interesting summer money wise. :eek:


Carl

Can you expand on your labeling the Face guys Lefties.

How on earth is this a smear on the left as you are suggesting?

It's not.

Modern capitalism is a gambling game in which the participants try to rig the game.

The right is the group that wants the games to be left alone so all can try and rig their bets the left wants capitalism to return to what it was pre casino days.


Why are you so damned confused about these things?

I think he thinks Facebook folks are lefties because he things folks a on the right are to scared to use Facebook. All that info about them out there would require them to scrap the guns and buy tanks to feel safe.

Wow, and here I thought Dodd-Frank fixed all that....

Don, commies, pinkos, marxists... ;) :D

Couldn't resist, sorry.

Pete

Open up your closed little mind, noone. I believe you've participated in the rants in this forum against corporate greed and the evils of capitalism. Yet, here are some prominent leftists who got caught all wide - eyed at the prospect of making a killing in the market. Using your terms, they were willing to "rig their bets" by over-valuing their stock price in an IPO. Now that they're caught with a bit of egg on their face, how do you account for their actions?

Not my label. Zuckerberg and Sandberg are fairly open in their support for the Donkeys.

Nothing short of a revolution can fix things now. Everything else is just a little band aide to make us feel warm and fuzzy during the continued rapes.

Nice run on the banks this year, then bread riots next year, who knows? :p


Carl

Thanks to stone-walling by the GOP on Obama appointments they are still writing the rules of Dodd Frank. Wall Street is lobbying like mad to water it dow, Jamie Dim-One was a major player in that lobbying. But you knew that.:p

I don't care if he's a Democrat, Republican or Martian, I have little love for Zuckerman. I would not be surprised to find that he was involved in some finagling to multiply his already obscene wealth. The guy makes a profit by selling people's identities. You won't see me running to his defense.

What you are identifying in your post, Whell, is the corruption inherent in an economic system based on greed.

Regards,

D-Ray

The blame for this debacle lies with Morgan Stanley, not Zuckerberg.

There's a difference between greed and operating in one's own self interest. Self interest does not include deceitful behavior, and includes by definition taking care of the folks that will be your customers. Greed is self - destructive.

The economic system is not based on greed, and this is a major flaw in the thought process of some on the left, including the current occupant of the White House. Individuals operate in a self destructive manner when they attempt to rig the system in their favor, manipulate others, and take on more risk than most others would find acceptable with their self destructive behavior.

Anyone can lose site of operating in their own self interest and succumb to greed. This is not behavior that is exclusive to the left or right. It may very well be operative in the unfolding story of the Facebook IPO, and as such should be instructive about the failures of individuals, not the indictment of an economic system.

Do you actually believe that Morgan Stanley set the value of the IPO on their own? Did they calculate the shares of stock available in the IPO on their own? Did they dictate the timing of Zuckerberg's shares of stock on their own? Was Zuckerberg unaware of the late - moving revised guidance on revenue that preceded the IPO, and revised revenue expectations for Facebook downward?

Not likely.

It was indeed their responsibility to do so.

I just do not see any real value in facebook. I have been registered for years
and at one time, a few years back it was mostly a place where singles and
twenty somethings hung out, talked about beer, video games, coffee and
"hooked up" with one another. So at the time all that was going on, it was
probably a company that could have charged a monthly fee and attracted
advertising. But all that's over now and has been for a while. Now it's place
riddled with 5th graders, grandma's posting pics of their filthy darling grandkids
and scorned divorced women posting pics of their stupid ass house cats,
forwarding chain letters so the innocent will feel guilty and creating drama.
I would much rather spend my money eleswhere.

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/...tumble/257573/

Try that.

Interesting breakdown and explanation video report on CBS. Other related today's video reports on the right too.
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7409454n


Carl

Great article Rob.


Carl

It does not matter what the price was set at. No one had to buy it. In fact many lucky people were precluded from buying the IPO.

This is very weak! Lefty label is deserving of more substantive association. :D

Beautifully stated Whell.

Cute but wrong.

It stands to reason that these high-tech innovators are liberals. Nearly all are, as are the hotbeds of high-tech innovation (Cambridge, MA; Silicon Valley, CA; and Seattle, WA). You don't see a spate of high tech innovation coming out of Mississippi.;)

lol


...

So what happened to you. Bush voter and all. ;)

Regards,

D-Ray

IMHO, whoever invented the koozie has done far more to benefit mankind than these two jerkoffs who came up with Facebook.

Chas

More fairytale than textbook economics with the heavy
Originally Posted by whell
"There's a difference between greed and operating in one's own self interest. Self interest does not include deceitful behavior, and includes by definition taking care of the folks that will be your customers. Greed is self - destructive.

The economic system is not based on greed, and this is a major flaw in the thought process of some on the left, including the current occupant of the White House. Individuals operate in a self destructive manner when they attempt to rig the system in their favor, manipulate others, and take on more risk than most others would find acceptable with their self destructive behavior.

Anyone can lose site of operating in their own self interest and succumb to greed. This is not behavior that is exclusive to the left or right. It may very well be operative in the unfolding story of the Facebook IPO, and as such should be instructive about the failures of individuals, not the indictment of an economic system. "

Sounds like a cry for regulation from an already distressed economic system Whell & BH:mad: BTW get a room you two.;)

Portraying it as left-right thing is kinda funny. I don't see anyone giving a pass to Zuckerman. Sheesh, I want his ass deported and no tourist visas to come home for a visit. Hell, this guy isn't even an American citizen anymore. Do the super rich really run like rats off what they consider a sinkin' ship? Wouldn't be the first time..

Yeah, just can't trust a lyin' ass businessman can you?

It is a truly sad fact.

Yeah, but they prolly made more money than the Koozie guy........

And certainly made more money than .......YOU.:p

Wrong! During Wall Street's glory days the big finance firms were private partnerships and each partner's own money was on the line. They managed the risk.

Once these firms went public they were risking other people's money. Given the big bonuses being handed out, risk management went out the window in the face of - GREED.

Not wrong. Publicly traded companies have a fiduciary responsibility to the company share holders not to expose the company to excessive risk. As you're seeing with the Facebook IPO, individuals also have legal recourse / remedies if a trade was handled improperly.

Don't know about Sandberg but I believe he is very active in the Democratic party.

Zukerburg is a no declaration voter on his last voter registration. That does not really matter much since he has only voted a couple of times since 2002. He Does not contribute money to political campaigns, except for $2400 donation to Carly Fiorina's campaign. Fiorina is a Republican.

He does like Obama, but many people do. He has pledged to donate 50% of his wealth to charity over the years just like Warren Buffet , George Lucas, and Bill gates have done. He donated 100 million directly to the Newark school system. He does donate money.

A lot of people assume he is a Democrat because he is a New York Jew and we all know they vote Democratic. The problem with that theory is Zuckerburg is an atheist. It is right there on his Facebook page.

My conclusion is Zuckerburg has no party affiliation and is not very interested in politics or religion. He is a programmer. Most true hackers don't care about any thing but their next line of code.

I am sure there are tons of right wing websites claiming that Zuckerburg is a hardcore Democrat who has donated millions of dollars to Democrats.

Eduardo Saverin is the Facebook co-founder that renounced his citizenship. Zuckerman is still an American citizen living in California.

I stand corrected, I did mean Severing.:rolleyes:

So pray tell what law or regulation enforces that "fiduciary responsibility"? Since Gramm and company removed all regulation greed became the dominant factor. When faced with six figure bonuses all they needed to say was "I was sure that (insert your favourite financial instrument) was going to pay off" and there is not a damn thing the Justice Department or state Attornies General could do.

As to the facebook fiasco let's wait and see, somehow I don't excpect anyone to do serious time.:rolleyes:

29 USC § 1109 - Liability for breach of fiduciary duty