Today's GOP

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by whell

I think the Repubs are in transition. They're now moving to the right of the country club Repubs that the Dems used to find so easy to buffalo. I think that's a good thing. The Repubs don't have too many friends in the press, so they'll never win the PR war.

Change is hard, and they'll step on their weenies more than once in the process. However, I'll wait until this stew is cooked before I pass final judgement.

However, right back at you with the same question. I'll post it in a different thread.

Except, if you understood late 19th and 20th century history, you'd know we've already been down the path the GOP is trying to revisit. For most Americans----it SUCKED. That's why they rebelled against unbridled corporate power in the first place. Ford, Carnegie, Morgan and the likes may have built industry but they were also colossal dicks. Slave driving tyrants. I guess we have to put our kids & grand kids through it to figure it out for the second time.

Dave

[merrylander]

As Will and Ariel Durant put it "Those who do not know their history are doomed to repeat it."

[whell]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

Except, if you understood late 19th and 20th century history, you'd know we've already been down the path the GOP is trying to revisit. For most Americans----it SUCKED. That's why they rebelled against unbridled corporate power in the first place. Ford, Carnegie, Morgan and the likes may have built industry but they were also colossal dicks. Slave driving tyrants. I guess we have to put our kids & grand kids through it to figure it out for the second time.

Dave

Except, if you look at the progressive expansion of government since that time, you'd note that the legislative and corporate landscapes bear little resemblance to the late 19th and 20th century. At that time we had aggressive economic expansion, dreary working conditions, and a more limited role in the economy for the gov't.

Today we have a legal framework which supports worker rights, a government that plays a very active role in the regulation and direction of economic activity and about 2% annual GDP growth. We also have low to zero job growth and the longest stretch of unemployment over 8% in our history. For many Americans, IT SUCKS. Now that's not to say that worker protection is bad, all regulation is bad, etc. But the pendulum has swung far enough not only to make a return to the early 20th century extremely unlikely, but it may be choking our ability to pull more quickly out of this recession, for example.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

Except, if you look at the progressive expansion of government since that time, you'd note that the legislative and corporate landscapes bear little resemblance to the late 19th and 20th century. At that time we had aggressive economic expansion, dreary working conditions, and a more limited role in the economy for the gov't.

Today we have a legal framework which supports worker rights, a government that plays a very active role in the regulation and direction of economic activity and about 2% annual GDP growth. We also have low to zero job growth and the longest stretch of unemployment over 8% in our history. For many Americans, IT SUCKS. Now that's not to say that worker protection is bad, all regulation is bad, etc. But the pendulum has swung far enough not only to make a return to the early 20th century extremely unlikely, but it may be choking our ability to pull more quickly out of this recession, for example.

That's a very cogent and powerful argument that I mostly agree with. Too bad the GOP is so discredited, not to mention preoccupied with establishing its looniness bona fides, that it is unable to credibly make such cogent arguments.

[JJIII]

Originally Posted by Boreas

No, I didn't. Since it fails to acknowledge any brickbats from the Right and merely concedes that the Left's contributions aren't entirely negative, I don't see it as a defense of your unfairly one-sided statement.

John

OK, I hereby acknowledge that the right throws muck around too. I thought that was clear in my post. I guess not clear enough.

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by whell

Today we have a legal framework which supports worker rights,

We do?

I recall calling the NLRB once with a question. I got a recorded message that reminded me of the minimum wage and overtime laws, then hung up on me.

Yeah, that's awesome.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

We do?

I recall calling the NLRB once with a question. I got a recorded message that reminded me of the minimum wage and overtime laws, then hung up on me.

Yeah, that's awesome.

When compared to medieval times, we do (and that sometimes seems to be where the GOP wants to take us). Compared to other First World democracies? Not so much.

[Boreas]

Originally Posted by finnbow

When compared to medieval times, we do (and that sometimes seems to be where the GOP wants to take us). Compared to other First World democracies? Not so much.

Be fair, Pat. The Gilded Age would suit them just fine.

These creeps want to roll back virtually every scrap of social and labor legislation enacted since TR's day.

John

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by Boreas

Be fair, Pat. The Gilded Age would suit them just fine.

These creeps want to roll back virtually every scrap of social and labor legislation enacted since TR's day.

John

My mistake. They only want to return to medieval times with their social policies. Their economic policies are far more modern, as you say.

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by whell

Except, if you look at the progressive expansion of government since that time, you'd note that the legislative and corporate landscapes bear little resemblance to the late 19th and 20th century. At that time we had aggressive economic expansion, dreary working conditions, and a more limited role in the economy for the gov't.

Today we have a legal framework which supports worker rights, a government that plays a very active role in the regulation and direction of economic activity and about 2% annual GDP growth. We also have low to zero job growth and the longest stretch of unemployment over 8% in our history. For many Americans, IT SUCKS. Now that's not to say that worker protection is bad, all regulation is bad, etc. But the pendulum has swung far enough not only to make a return to the early 20th century extremely unlikely, but it may be choking our ability to pull more quickly out of this recession, for example.

Dr. No's wife Chao did a very good job of dismanteling any worker protection we might have had. I listened to T shirt maker in Tampa going on, and on, about government regulation. So why are people working 10 and 11 hour days if there is so much worker protection? Listening to whiny business men gets old very quickly.