Alas, Kiev.

[Oerets]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/vi...soldiers-video

[nailer]

Originally Posted by BigElCat

I think the expression is 'pushing up daisies'.

The uncle whose name I answer to "bought the farm" on Luzon in '45.

[bobabode]

Originally Posted by RickeyM

I saw a report of an elderly Ukraine lady confronting a Russian soldier on the street and ended the conversation by saying something to the effect that he should put sunflower seeds in his pockets so sunflowers would grow where he fell and died.

Many historical events where an outnumbered and out gunned force prevailed. Also ones where the victorious force was made to pay a heavy price.

Auntie isn't taking their shit lying down. Brave lady.

[bobabode]

Originally Posted by Oerets

https://www.theguardian.com/world/vi...soldiers-video

Thanks for that link.

[BigElCat]

Here's how I see it; this war will remain conventional, civilian casualties will skyrocket now that they are all citizen-soldiers, and Putin will succeed in taking and holding all of the Ukraine.

Internal strife in Russia may put an end to Putin's reign, but not before the Ukraine is lost.

[Oerets]

What I fear is Putin will turn it up to eleven and beyond. Being brutal in ways we can't even imagine fully.
He is cornered an loosing. Both very bad for his mental health and sanity. Before he could not trust his underlings. Using intimation and fear to control. If there is a failed attempt towards him from inside and he feels lost.

Murder suicide comes to mind.

[BigElCat]

Originally Posted by Oerets

What I fear is Putin will turn it up to eleven and beyond. Being brutal in ways we can't even imagine fully.
He is cornered an loosing. Both very bad for his mental health and sanity. Before he could not trust his underlings. Using intimation and fear to control. If there is a failed attempt towards him from inside and he feels lost.

Murder suicide comes to mind.

Putin has more money than Jeff Bezos. Idi Amin was granted political asylum, Putin would get the same treatment. He not losing the way our media presents it.

He's going to crank it up to 11, for sure. The Russian soldiers are going to get sick and tired of the people singing to them one minute, and shooting at them the next.

The nuclear talk is just that; talk. Putin's not going there. I'm sure the West is on DEFCON 2 by now. Just how it is.

[RickeyM]

I think the harder Putin goes against Ukraine the bigger the protests will get in Russia. This is not the Russian peoples war and Ukraine is not their enemy. Putin is trying to keep the truth from his people but it will eventually get out. Ukraine will get "anonymous" help but will it be enough? If/when Putin brings heavy force against Ukraine and still doesn't over run Ukraine what will Putin do then?

On a separate question aside from the invasion what would happen to Russia if Putin would suddenly drop dead or otherwise lose the "presidency" of Russia?

[BigElCat]

Originally Posted by RickeyM

On a separate question aside from the invasion what would happen to Russia if Putin would suddenly drop dead or otherwise lose the "presidency" of Russia?

The 21st century being what it is, Putin's security team would probably mount him on a furniture dolly, wheel him around like Ferris Bueller.

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

By implication: He wanted to destroy Ukraine.

Putin doesn't want to destroy Ukraine. He needs the Ukraine economy, he needs the Ukraine wealth of natural resources, he needs, more than anything to keep Ukraine out of the European Union.

All this babbling about NATO membership is a purposeful distraction. NATO membership of Ukraine doesn't hurt Russia...it probably doesn't hurt Putin all that much, outside of his feeble, fragile Trump-like ego.

What this is about is Ukraine EU membership which would be just another nail in coffin of the already half-dead Russian economy. It's their own fault, of course...all the benefits of whatever Russian economy there is...go directly to the oligarchs that control all of it, and to their partnership with Putin which keeps the billions rolling in to them and keeps Putin in the power and control required to soothe his pathetic, pre-adolescent ego. From day one of the fall of the Soviet Union...none of the benefits of their newly "free" economy has ever trickled down to the average Russian.

There's something wrong with Russians. They get out from under the despotism of the monarchy, only to trade it in for the despostism of the "communist" state, only to trade it in for the despotism of this fucking autocrat. It's one despot after another in Russia. Russians are like a chronically abused kid who's been the victim of maltreatment for so long that he thinks there's something wrong if daddy isn't whipping his ass with a belt every day.

"Every nation gets the government it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre

Part of my social work job for a few years while I was finishing my master's degree was to handle refugee cases through an agency partnership with World Relief. Tough work...what the hell can I do for a poor Cambodian guy who is the only remaining living member of a family of three generations? Anyway...and this was in the years just prior to the fall of the USSR, I provided services to a number of Russian immigrants/refugees. Several of the Russian women were quite frank about their experiences with and attitudes toward Russian men. A common theme was "I like American men...Russian men are drunk assholes."