Israel has invaded Gaza...

[whell]

Well, that's one way to look at it I guess.

The fundamental flaw with that analysis is that the only folks who have it as their stated agenda to kill the other side in the conflict is Hamas. Hamas will not be satisfied until the Jews are exterminated and Israel is destroyed. That desire is stated right in the Hamas Charter, and its repeated often not only by Hamas but their allies in Iran, Hezbollah, etc.

Their like minded pals in ISIS are busy doing the same thing to the Christian minority in Iraq, issuing the order that Christians in Iraq need to get out our they'll be killed. So none of this should come as a surprise.

The argument from my perspective is pretty simple. The first question to answer is whether or not all parties to the disagreement agree that Israel has the right to exist. The aggressors in this disagreement - I view the aggressors as Hamas (and before them the PLO at least in recent history) - would answer that question with a categorical and resounding "Hell no!" If that's the case, and Hamas also wants the Jews to be dead (as well as anyone else they might deem "evil") and doesn't appear poised to accept any compromise, than conflict in inevitable. Hamas also states in their charter that they don't believe in negotiations, and that "There is no solution to the Palestinian Problem except by Jihad."

So, they want to kill Jews and anyone else who is evil, the won't negotiate, and they don't accept the right of Israel to exist. What alternatives, then, do you see in resolving this (other than trying to contain it as Israel has been doing) other than destroying Hamas?

Here's the Hamas Charter if you're interested in checking out where they're coming from:

http://www.palestine-studies.org/files/pdf/jps/1734.pdf

There's a few different interpretations of some of the language out there on the internet. But the translations read pretty much the same.

[Pio1980]

This is a rather imbalanced one-sided assessment that leaves out the hard line Hebrew element that makes any engagement all-but impossible.

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[whell]

Originally Posted by Pio1980

This is a rather imbalanced one-sided assessment that leaves out the hard line Hebrew element that makes any engagement all-but impossible.

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Not really.

In Israel's recent history - going back to the negotiations between Begin / Arafat / Clinton - Israel gave Arafat just about everything they'd said they wanted, and Arafat rejected it. The so-called "peace process" has been going on for over 60 years, broken by periodic armed conflict and cease fires that don't stick.

At some point, you need to call it how you see it, and the only way to see this IMHO - particularly in light of the Hamas Charter - is that negotiations haven't worked, and are not likely to work with Hamas in the future.

[piece-itpete]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

Or it can pay about 100,000 people about 10,000 a year, for their government job, in an economy way short of jobs that pay money.

Or it could all go for Big Macs.

Look, all you were doing was making a RW bullshit point about how the Palestinians are assholes and everything bad is their fault. And it's bullshit because all you have is this lightweight 'hey this sounds bad' innuendo.

Why don't you do some digging. Get some serious information. Get chapter and verse about what fucked-up assholes the Palestinians are. Get testimony and documents, and glossy pictures. Then get back to me.

Yes sir. Whoops, I mean, pound sand Imagine paying out money to patronage jobs instead of say people building infrastructure for lasting improvement. Although that does sound eerily familiar.

The billion + a year isn't innuendo however inconvenient it may be.

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

Well put. Of course when such comes out of a lefty like me, I'm bigotted scum.

Not a shocker at all, Pete. As much as I love France, the anti-Semitism in France is pretty bad. During the nazi occupation it was a pretty bad place for Jews to be due to the behavior of the French, as well as the Germans. And particularly in the south of France, where serious anti-Semitic attitudes continue to prevail.

I thought all lefties were bigoted scum

Originally Posted by whell

I think that's pronounced "hooked on nymphos".

Hooked on p-funk groupies?

Pete

[Pio1980]

The land-for-peace betrayal was a huge mistake for long-term Palestinian advantage and closed the door in that direction for good reason.

This can go on forever as-is or they can reset the clock and get serious about a peaceful settlement. It's their future.
Thnx for keeping this civil and intelligent.

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[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by Pio1980

This is a rather imbalanced one-sided assessment that leaves out the hard line Hebrew element that makes any engagement all-but impossible.

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Oh c'mon...the only hard liners in the mix that would happily throw a wrench into the peace works...are Hebrews???? And we carp at the right wingers for their conveniently narrow analyses and positions.

[Pio1980]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

Oh c'mon...the only hard liners in the mix that would happily throw a wrench into the peace works...are Hebrews???? And we carp at the right wingers for their conveniently narrow analyses and positions.

I did NOT say "only", there are at least three recalcitrant participants in this embroligo.
So the settlement movement isn't a factor?

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[Zeke]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

Oh c'mon...the only hard liners in the mix that would happily throw a wrench into the peace works...are Hebrews????

They're the entitlement oppressors...

[Dondilion]

I have often question Hamas tactics. I personally do not like Hamas.

However it looks like Hamas has won this one.

Hamas has exposed Israel. That is why Israel is now so mad with CNN.

[djv8ga]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

That is why Israel is now so mad with CNN.

What BS. Why are they mad at CNN when the only people who watch that crap are a few Leftys like Bobabode?