Is Today's Trumpist GOP Fascist?

[donquixote99]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

Trump prevented a third and possibly fourth term of Clinton. That is undeniable.

The Clintons' attempt to circumvent the Constitution (re number of terms) is often downplayed. But I leave that to the historians. Check Bill Clinton on the Tarmac.

Well, here's 'the story' on the Tarmac meeting. You can believe whatever you want about it I suppose, but I certainly don't think Bill got any favors out of the Justice Dept after that, and Hillary of course got torpedoed by the FBI.

It's circumvention only if Bill would have been President-in-effect, and I find that idea, with regard to Hillary, truly ridiculous.

https://qz.com/1306227/in-the-inspec...tarmac-meeting

[Rajoo]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

Trump prevented a third and possibly fourth term of Clinton. That is undeniable.

The Clintons' attempt to circumvent the Constitution (re number of terms) is often downplayed. But I leave that to the historians. Check Bill Clinton on the Tarmac.

So he did, but what did we get in return?

Four years of chaos, absence of any governance and an ill managed pandemic that cost us 500K lives. This after our country developed two of the best vaccines in record time. And for his treachery, he got impeached twice and both impeachments were legitimate, not political. And its quite possible that he will collect more indictments than his age soon.

He will go down in modern history as the worst president ever.

So did Trump prevent a third Bush?

And as for the Clintons, you are beginning to sound our MSU comrade.

[RickeyM]

Someone mentioned clutching at straws. I see it now. FWIW Hillary in the WH possibly would not have led us to a war that destabilized the entire Middle East. So there is that.

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

D. is in a bind. He knows the Donald and company are fascist assholes, but he also doesn't like us liberals, thinks we are deluded, or virtue-signaling phonies, or condescending cultural elitists, or all of the above. Right now he's in a phase where he clutches to anything 'good' he can find regarding Trump, and ignores everything else. And trolls us a little here and there.

The thing is, you can't do this without abandoning decency and integrity. Dondilion supports the marginalization of LGBTQ, and women through his support of Republican politicians. He supports voting suppression on minority Americans, young Americans, poor Americans and disabled Americans. It's despicable and it's a choice he's made.

And when called on it, he responds with smarmy comments that he thinks are funny. What he is, is a fucking coward who when it comes down to it has no argument or debate, only sycophantic bullshit like "third and fourth Clinton Presidency."

[Dondilion]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

The thing is, you can't do this without abandoning decency and integrity. Dondilion supports the marginalization of LGBTQ, and women through his support of Republican politicians. He supports voting suppression on minority Americans, young Americans, poor Americans and disabled Americans. It's despicable and it's a choice he's made.

And when called on it, he responds with smarmy comments that he thinks are funny. What he is, is a fucking coward who when it comes down to it has no argument or debate, only sycophantic bullshit like "third and fourth Clinton Presidency."

Basically, I am trying to find the reason why Clinton is given such a big pass although he and Trump are cut from the same cloth. They are both grabbing by the P. The only difference is that Trump is more upfront.

Mention the effect of Clinton's triangulation on the marginal, his offshoring on the middle and it is like one has committed a great sin...there is hasty circling of the wagon.

BTW this old fellow has given many years volunteering in areas relating to housing and maths education.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

Basically, I am trying to find the reason why Clinton is given such a big pass although he and Trump are cut from the same cloth. They are both grabbing by the P. The only difference is that Trump is more upfront.

However, misogyny is pretty much the only thing they have in common. Clinton was very intelligent and interested in public policy. Trump is neither. Trump commits economic and national security crimes relentlessly, Clinton didn't. Clinton's lies were within the confines of normal American political discourse. Trump lies indiscriminately about everything. Trump threatens violence at the hands of his political followers, Clinton didn't. Clinton believed in democracy and the rule of law, Trump doesn't. Need I go on? And this commentary comes from a guy who was a Republican at the time and not a Clinton fan (indeed I was selected for a fairly high career position in the George H.W. Bush's administration, the guy Clinton beat).

I think Putin love has colored your views of his protege and admirer, Donald Trump.

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

Basically, I am trying to find the reason why Clinton is given such a big pass although he and Trump are cut from the same cloth. They are both grabbing by the P. The only difference is that Trump is more upfront.

Mention the effect of Clinton's triangulation on the marginal, his offshoring on the middle and it is like one has committed a great sin...there is hasty circling of the wagon.

BTW this old fellow has given many years volunteering in areas relating to housing and maths education.

Its the same old, same old alt-right propaganda. You act like jobs going overseas started with Bill Clinton. That is bullshit, and you know it. The outsourcing and offshoring trend began in the 60s and 70s as large corporations transferred their manufacturing processes to lower-cost countries. General Electric was one of the pioneers of outsourcing at the time. Bill Clinton wasnt President until 1993, and he had nothing to say about how Jack Welch was going to run GE. Outsourcing and offshoring have always been the responsibility of corporate America, just like the current rate of inflation is on corporate America. And Welch, the dark prince of offshoring, was a climate change denying asshole Republican...definitely one of yours.

It's a global economy...thats the way it goes. You fuckwits are making a political isue out of something that is way, way past being a political issue.

[donquixote99]

The fact that corporations have so much power to move jobs and capital with about zero oversight should be a political issue. No checks and balances for them?

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

The fact that corporations have so much power to move jobs and capital with about zero oversight should be a political issue. No checks and balances for them?

There are certainly legitimate concerns regarding offshoring of subcontractor manufacturing, and also the shifting around of capital assets. I'm assuming there are laws regarding the latter...but they probably favor American corporate interests and not the interests of the American people. And then we have the endless debating about what serves the people? Does the reduced cost of certain products that are made offshore, or where parts of those products are made offshore, benefit the American consumer? Would American consumers immediately switch to Samsung Android phones if their iPhones cost three or four times what they cost now? Probably. So...there are lots of variables, and Trump's use of fucked up tariffs ended up screwing everything up, mostly for American farmers, and the American people who have had to pay for the enormous increases in farm subsidies due to farmers being driven close to bankruptcy due to the fallout of the tariffs. It's complicated stuff...should the government be able to screw around with this stuff? Beats me.

But back to the discussion...my comments were related to the stupidity, disingenuousness, and lack of integrity we have to deal with in any discussion with our pal D., or any others of his cohort. Bill Clinton is the reason why there is outsourcing and offshoring...steaming load of horse shit.

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by Dondilion

Basically, I am trying to find the reason why Clinton is given such a big pass although he and Trump are cut from the same cloth. They are both grabbing by the P. The only difference is that Trump is more upfront.

The only difference is that Trump is now a legally identified sexual assault perp. So...Bill's a bad husband, and Hillary has forgiven him. Kathleen Willey chased Clinton all over DC according to testimony by her friend Linda Tripp in the investigation. And Monica...well, Monica has managed to turn her misfortune of being unable to resist the advances of Bill into a $41 million portfolio. Good for Monica.

Two of the most important things I found out in my quarter century of providing direct clinical services...
1. Two sides to every story
2. Everybody lies