mosque near ground zero ?

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

My son just read me an interesting Twitter post:

"We've been building ground zeroes near Iraqi mosques nonstop since 2003. Turnabout is fair play."

Ridiculous. There's no moral equivalent. How many Iraqi citizens greeted the Coalition troops arriving in Bagdad with cheers? How many New Yorkers cheered as the planes hit the Twin Towers?

It shows how much perspective we've lost in 9 years.

[Boreas]

Originally Posted by whell

Ridiculous. There's no moral equivalent. How many Iraqi citizens greeted the Coalition troops arriving in Bagdad with cheers? How many New Yorkers cheered as the planes hit the Twin Towers?

It shows how much perspective we've lost in 9 years.

What it really shows is how little we've done to deserve the goodwill many Iraqis showed us when we "arrived".

John

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

Ridiculous. There's no moral equivalent. How many Iraqi citizens greeted the Coalition troops arriving in Bagdad with cheers? How many New Yorkers cheered as the planes hit the Twin Towers?

It shows how much perspective we've lost in 9 years.

Actually, you're right. There is no moral equivalent. BTW, I wasn't being serious, just throwing a little irony around.

But since you brought it up, there is absolutely nothing immoral about building an Islamic cultural center 2 blocks away from Ground Zero. I'll give you distasteful, provocative, or insensitive perhaps. But immoral? Emphatically not.

It is, however, highly immoral to attack a sovereign country on false grounds (Saddam's WMD's and collaboration with Al Qaeda) and kill 100,000 civilians in the process.

Not even close in my book.

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

If we as a nation allow the wingnut blogosphere and Murdoch to set public policy by manufacturing outrage, we're in a world of hurt. Murdoch and Fox are a much greater threat to America than this Imam and his cultural center.

How are Murdoch and Fox a threat to America at all?

Clearly a central tenet of your support for building the Mosque at near Ground Zero is based on Freedom of religion. You would subordinate the sensibilities of the 9/11 survivors and families of the victims to the right of Imam Rouf and company to build their mosque and "community center". Don't Murdoch and Fox have the same character of rights under the First Amendment as you would guarantee to Imam Rouf? If so, I'd guess that we'd also have to take the Huffington Post, The Nation, etc. off line to be consistent?

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

It is, however, highly immoral to attack a sovereign country on false grounds (Saddam's WMD's and collaboration with Al Qaeda) and kill 100,000 civilians in the process.

I've already been accused of thread hi-jacking once. I won't take the bait here. We can debate the justification of the Iraq war in another thread, though the topic might be a bit worn out.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

How are Murdoch and Fox a threat to America at all?

Clearly a central tenet of your support for building the Mosque at near Ground Zero is based on Freedom of religion. You would subordinate the sensibilities of the 9/11 survivors and families of the victims to the right of Imam Rouf and company to build their mosque and "community center". Don't Murdoch and Fox have the same character of rights under the First Amendment as you would guarantee to Imam Rouf? If so, I'd guess that we'd also have to take the Huffington Post, The Nation, etc. off line to be consistent?

I said nothing about taking Murdoch and Fox offline. It was just a comment concerning a previous post I made whereby this kerfuffle was demonstrably "manufactured outrage" on the part of a wingnut blogger and her enablers/cheering section at Fox, and above all the fact that it's sad that the nation gets its knickers in a twist about such contrived outrage.

Actually, I'm quite indifferent about the "mosque." However, the Right's outrage about Obama not doing anything about it runs counter to their "bedrock conservative principles" of limited government, property rights and defending the constitution. Bedrock, indeed.

For the very same reason (the First Amendment), I support Fox/Murdoch's right to exist and the Imam's right to build his "cultural center" wherever he and the city fathers of NYC deem appropriate.

That said, Fox News' deliberate misleading "advocacy journalism" is not the best way to an informed electorate and an elevation of political discourse. Same applies to Maddow and Olbermann, BTW.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

I've already been accused of thread hi-jacking once. I won't take the bait here. We can debate the justification of the Iraq war in another thread, though the topic might be a bit worn out.

I was just trying to confuse you with the facts (and respond to the specious moral equivalency thing).

[piece-itpete]

Brrr. The cold wind of moral relativism.

Pete

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by finnbow

But since you brought it up, there is absolutely nothing immoral about building an Islamic cultural center 2 blocks away from Ground Zero. .

It's 4 blocks from where the Towers were and these are city blocks.

The entire thing is totally disingenuous.

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by whell

How are Murdoch and Fox a threat to America at all?

Clearly a central tenet of your support for building the Mosque at near Ground Zero is based on Freedom of religion. You would subordinate the sensibilities of the 9/11 survivors and families of the victims to the right of Imam Rouf and company to build their mosque and "community center". Don't Murdoch and Fox have the same character of rights under the First Amendment as you would guarantee to Imam Rouf? If so, I'd guess that we'd also have to take the Huffington Post, The Nation, etc. off line to be consistent?

Yes they have the right to say what they want but it is portrayed as truth which makes it unethical. Furthermore Murdock and his empire was designed to mislead the populous in order to advance the agenda of the wealth. You find this a positive thing?