Todays job application...
 

So I am getting prepared to sell my place and move to the other side of the mountain. The hardest part, as always, is finding employment in rural areas. I decided to submit an application to Nosler, a manufacturer of guns, ammunition, and accessories located here in Bend, with a recently opened facility in Redmond. Their job application says a lot about them. I think I may not even apply after all.

Their statement before even beginning the application, followed by a required supplement.



Nosler, Inc. is committed to excellence, integrity, and service. We are leaders in the industry, and as such demand excellence from our staff. To be an employee of Nosler, Inc. the following standard MUST apply for each applicant…

- You will need your driver’s license to complete the application
- You will need a completely clean criminal record – this includes DUI and any type of Game Violation
- We are 100% drug free – don’t waste your time filling out the application if you can’t pass a drug test


Required Supplement: Prospective Employee Questionnaire

Do you know what we manufacture at Nosler?

The 2nd Amendment protects the right of the American people to keep and bear arms. What is your view on this?

Are you a member of the National Rifle Association? Yes No

What is your view on Handguns & Assault Rifle platform firearms?

Do you participate in the shooting sports or shooting sports activities?

What is your stance on legalized marijuana?

Have you ever participated in team sports?

Are they legally able to ask some of those questions?
I'm not an HR expert, but can they disqualify you for personal opinions regarding guns, NRA, and marihuana ?

I always thought that as long as you did your job adequately, you could hold any personal opinion you want to in your private life.

If I was desperate for a job I'd lie and tell them what I think they want to hear.

But since I'm not, I'd answer "yes" to the first one and "None of your fucking business" to the other six.

Here's what I think. They're legally permitted to ask but the applicant isn't legally required to answer. Don't answer, however, and they'll find some reason (or no reason) not to hire that person. Though, there is such a thing as wrongful dismissal, there really isn't much beyond race and gender that would amount to "wrongful failure to hire."

It's interesting to consider whether the employer would be entitled to dismiss an employee if they let their NRA membership lapse.:)

Marc, forget about those jerks!

I would think they'd respect the 'none of your fucking business' answers if they were really the personal freedom advocates they no doubt think they are....

Of course, if they were such advocates, they wouldn't ask those sorts of questions.

I think employers go way overboard on intrusive questions. I believe credit checks for prospective employees should be against the law. Recently a former co-worker recovering from a medical issue was not re-hired because they failed a "personality test".
Can you believe that ? This was at my part-time civilian hospital. The medical issue was cancer.

No wonder employment is stagnant.

That sounds like a lawsuit to me.

Since people will lie to get jobs, the company might find it hard to ascertain if it employed a lot of pretenders.

One can just imagine the work area gun hawk conversations.

From what I know they were let go because they missed too much work because of the treatment and reconstructive surgery required. I do not think they were full or part time so perhaps disability/worker's comp did not come into play. They applied again recently and I was told by another co-worker that they were not taken back because of the personality test. The supervisors in our department wanted them back but it seems corporate did not. I was told they can retake the test in 4 months.

Many employers want people they can control, it's as simple as that.

I have a friend who is now a plant manager, recently told me that if you look at an application and see that an employee has been employed in a union environment, "...that's two strikes against them from the get-go.". I asked him if he would hire himself then, as he spent 12 years in maintenance at the paper mill.

Of course I never got an answer.

Anyhow, I probably wouldn't want to work in the gun place, unless I had little choice. If they felt compelled to ask, something tells me they might not be very tolerant in any other way, either. Mentioning ANY "liberal" thoughts at all would probably be a bulls eye on your back. You would have to make sure you are highly indispensable to them before you let them know you don't necessarily share their ideology.

I look for more of this kind of shit to become common practice in the future.

I see this kind of thing happen where I work..... They want to get rid of someone for some reason that won't make it through HR so they come up with another reason they can use to get rid of someone.

Interestingly enough, I am slightly involved in something similar where I work. (Gov agency)
Myself and another lady (I am white she is black) both went through very similar breast cancer experiences last year. We both had the same treatment from the same doctors. We both had to take time off.
I was told..... Take as much time as you need, is there any accommodations we can make for you, what can we do to help.

She was told, you can't take more time off, you have to have your doctor write that you have no work restrictions and he has to release you earlier than what he is saying, you will lose your job if you can't keep your work load up.

She is no longer at work and I'm not clear what her status is. I was called in by an investigator for an interview.

I don't know if skin color was the issue, but it sure seemed like it. She has begun litigation.

They do, it's ridiculous. I sat in a "panel" interview once, wherein this one woman kept asking me "Why are you seeking employment here at ____?" She asked me this four times and I answered four times. She started to ask a fifth time when one of the other panel members told her; "How many times does he have to answer that? The man's here because he needs a job, Sharon."

Regardless of what the company says, because employers lie all of the time, they were denied re-employment because of insurance risks. Another good reason for single payer healthcare.........cut the employer out of the picture. Employer sponsored healthcare needs to go straight into the trash, in it's entirety. Your healthcare issues should have nothing to do with your job unless they render you incapable of performing your job.

Which among those questions do you believe goes to the quality of a potential hire?

Can a teetotaler be a good bartender?

Is she a contractor or an actual government employee?

Might be a great bartender. Think about it.

If it comes down to lying or having your family go hungry, who can blame them?

Shit, I'd lie like a rug.

So, we suspect profiling to a political litmus test.

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Just for the Hell of it I am going to go ahead and answer these question as honestly as I can.


Do you know what we manufacture at Nosler?


I know you make bullets because I do a little reloading myself. However I've never bought Nosler's because they are pricey and I'm a cheap SOB. I generally buy Berry's or Remingtons, or Winchesters. I don't know what else you make but if you have a brochure on it I'll read it.

The 2nd Amendment protects the right of the American people to keep and bear arms. What is your view on this?


I support the second amendment. I think the wording is pretty obtuse but I take it to mean that private citizens have a right to own and posses firearms.

Are you a member of the National Rifle Association? Yes No


No. Too right wing for me.

I like revolvers myself, but pistols are OK too. Assault rifles should be limited to the Military only. No civilian needs a goddamned assault rifle. I don't know what the fuck you mean by "platform". What the fuck is an Assault Rifle Platform Firearm?

Do you participate in the shooting sports or shooting sports activities?


I like to shoot at a range or out in the boondocks on occasion. I don't hunt. I don't want to shoot animals. The only thing I could kill with a gun would be a human being. Well, no, I take that back. I don't like Crocodiles. I could shoot a Crocodile. No, make that Crocodiles and rats. I don't like rats either.

What is your stance on legalized marijuana?

I don't give a shit one way or the other.

Have you ever participated in team sports?

I played some little league baseball. I sucked at it, but my old man was the coach so he kept me on the team. But I didn't get to play much because I sucked.

I went out for Football one year in High School but I sucked at it, so I quit.

Played a little intramural basketball in college and sucked at that too but not as much as I sucked at Football so I finished one season.

I played a season of City League softball too. Mostly on the bench because I sucked.

We had an employeer here in 2012 that tried to fire an employee because they admitted to voting for Obama. Court took a dim view, there are laws about threatening or intimidating people to compel their votes. Employeer decided to settle out of court.

http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/...ing-for/ncQHN/

I don't fire anyone - I can't afford to. It is hard enough finding anyone who wants to work.

Also, a bit off topic and veering into "the state of education territory" - I recently ran an ad for prospective employees; never had to before because I usually hire by referral. Had a lot of my kids graduating college, so need replacements.

I'm not hiring people to build atom bombs - just park cars, don't wreck, and be friendly.
I am prob. the best boss in the world - I basically let them write their own schedule - as long as the shifts are covered it's all good.

The applications I have received this week are horrible - 300 of them - I'm not looking for nuclear physicists, but the ability to spell, form a complete sentence, include your last name, etc. are things I would like to see.

I'm not seeing them.

I would as well. In fact I have and continue to lie whenever it's necessary and prudent to do so, to keep my job. Once an employer lies to me, I see no reason why it isn't fair turnabout to lie back.

I hear ya. Lord knows I really don't "want" to work, but I have to. But, when I am at work, I believe I should hold up my end of the deal. However, that doesn't mean I will bust ass for anyone who doesn't hold up their end of the deal. If an employer starts reneging on his promises, I will start reneging on mine, as I start looking for another job.

Lazy, scheming and lying ass employers should always get what they have coming, even when they don't like it. Checks and balances, don't ya know.........

It's why they hate Unions.

See how that works?

I am prob actually the worst person to be a boss - I am not a disciplinarian and I am up front. I hire kids I like, and I usually like kids who have their shit somewhat together, so it never really morphs into that "employee - boss" dynamic.

I think that is the key - hire good people and you don't have to be "a boss."

The schedule is a headache because I really let them work when they want, but to me that is a small price to pay for having people who enjoy being there and have fun.

True dat.

And I never, ever let someone else drive/park my car. Except for the garage that services it......and close relatives. And, I am always with them when they do.

I've been lucky - 2 minor scuffs in 3 years - but, that's why we have insurance.

But I don't let anyone drive my car, either. ;)

But I am either overworked or just getting old.

Last night after an event, I drove downtown to check on our restaurant locations. I pull up to our busiest spot and my two guys are out there in the lot wearing football helmets and tossing the pigskin.

"WTF are you two doing?" Get that silly shit off your heads."

"You said it was cool to dress up for Halloween!"

"Oh, yeah. Halloween. Sorry."

Derp.

Cats, you might try going back to what as worked for you for recruitment. Get referrals. Calling cold to 'possible referrers' is more likely to work than wading through unscreened applications. Call teachers, coaches, anyone who works with young people. Offer a finder's fee if you hire. I'm thinking $20.00, so it should probably be $50.00 nowadays. But that's not the main motivator. Just sell the job a little, tell them what a cool boss you are. People love to hook kids they like up with good jobs.

BTW, get each person you get to talk to to refer another referrer, too.

Sometimes it's a last minute business - I have always used referrals and will continue - we just got a buttload of event business short notice and I need people quick.

I hate running ads.

English spelling has taken a serious nosedive lately... or else the internet has given us an opportunity to see how bad it always was. Another thing I've noticed is a significant decline in the grammar used in print media, even in august publications like the New York Times. It seems copy editors no longer know how to edit.

I hear you.

When I worked for the Florida DOT I parroted the Department Policy buzzwords plenty of times even when I felt they were bullshit.

Copy editors basically no longer exist.

oic.







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I have no idea what that means.

It's text speak, means Oh I see. The minimalist spelling was meant to express a very slight level of embarassment for telling you your business and not being right about it....

I didn't specify the need for quick hires until later in the thread.

Referrals always best, IMO.

I am not by nature, education, or previous profession a "business person," anyway. I am, however, good with people and enjoy working with the kids.

The financial management and reporting aspects were alien to me in the beginning - having to get proficient with them has helped me better attend to our household finances and organization.

Silver lining, etc.:)

It is actually very hard for me to move. My current employer has been awesome to me. He still hasn't quite accepted the fact that I want to move to be closer to my family. He has pretty much offered me anything and everything he can reasonably think of to get me to stay. I tried to explain to him that if I was leaving for any of those reasons, i wouldn't be searching 200 miles away for employment that will probably get me less money, worse benefits, and a worse schedule. The whole point is my daughter could use our help and I would like to participate in my granddaughter's life a bit more as she grows up. I don't get to see her as much as I used to since she started school last year.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...%20%282%29.jpg

I know how that feels. I have relatives that ask me quite frequently when I'm going to come home. (Near Youngstown, Ohio.) I do miss the people, well most of them anyhow. The hardest part was when my mother asked me why I stay in Virginia, just days before she passed away. The look in her eyes still haunts me nearly seven years later...........

However, the rub is that I honestly hate that fucking place. I hate it with a passion. Long, frigid winters, NO diversity, nothing to do. It's rural so jobs are hard to come by, "good jobs" are even harder. My hometown and many of it's ignorant, hayseed denizens are stuck in the '50s........Of all the places on earth to be from........ If it weren't for the fact that nearly all of my people are there, I wouldn't even consider it. I would forget it exists.

Here, I have the ocean, the beach, my astronomy club, all sorts of year round activities, the Mid-Atlantic Audiofests, plenty of interesting people from all walks of life to encounter, shorter, less brutal winters...........Sigh.

Friday my wife told me a co-worker was let go from the casino. She had been there 10 years, and my wife had worked with her since 2011. The reason? Every two years when the casino renews your id (which is your punch-in card) they do a credit check. Her friend had filed for bankruptcy. She was a custodian that cleaned restrooms. Not anyone who takes in cash or a cashier or comptroller. They got rid of her when they found out about the bankruptcy.

My outlook on Native American run casinos is negative. This place basically threw a person out the door like trash in my opinion.

Yeah, they would pour heftier drinks.