EU Military Expenditure
 

The United States currently pays for 75% of NATO expenses (hardware, logistics, trans., manpower, etc).

70 years after WWII, the largest European nations - individually and as NATO members - have consistently refused to increase their defense budgets, content to let the U.S. provide the bulk of what is necessary for their defense.

The EU is a fragile construction at best with continued wrangling over cooperation between member nations and how much power the EU parliament in Brussels should wield.

Whether EU nations individually begin to take more responsibility for their own defense or in concert with other member nations, the U.S. can not afford to continue our subsidies at the current levels.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-31619553

Spoken like an actual fiscal conservative. ;)

Regards,

D-Ray

Probably they have seen through the Russians are coming hysteria and perceived that the Americans are more than willing to pay. :D

How much of our defense budget goes to NATO compared to how much for for our Wars of Imperialist Aggression in the Middle East and our giveaways to our own Military Industrial Complex for overpriced contracts for shit we don't need?

The DOD budget:

http://comptroller.defense.gov/Porta...Green_Book.pdf

The Center for Strategic and International Studies Report - takes DOD to task for no effective budget mandates or cost controls:

http://csis.org/publication/fy2016-d...nd-data-points

Seriously?

Your going to try the old "instead of answering the question, throw a 275 page government document at them" trick?

Dude, I worked for a government agency for over 30 years. I've used that one myself a time or two. But it's not going to fly with me.

I have no idea - the #s are no doubt in the DOD budget reports for the years you are interested in and they are readily available.

The categories are not the best and as the CSIS noted, the DOD, the General Accounting Office, and the Congressional Budget Office all calculate their #s with different criteria.

I'm sure some gov. office has a synopsis of the cost of U.S. operations in Iraq and Afghanistan.

News accounting (Bloomberg, Wash Post, Time) all over the map - from 1.6 trillion to 6 trillion. A lot of money, regardless.

Well I'm not going to pick though a 275 page government document. I did more than my share of "reviewing" boring assed New York City Phonebook sized documents while I was a government employee.

However, I am pretty damned sure that what we spend on NATO is a spit in the ocean compared to what we have pissed away on the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and our government giveaway programs to the Military Industrial Complex.

So before we go after nickels and dimes, I favor going after hundreds of billions in waste.

I agree wholeheartedly about going after the waste - my post about EU/NATO should have been clearer - I am more concerned about them carrying their share of the load than the actual #s.

Yeah, that's a real pisser ain't it?

With all that money they save on defense, those damn Euro-commies are able to afford free health care and awesome public transportation. :mad:

Seriously though, who the Hell are we defending them from?

The big bad Russians?

We should just pull out and let them deal with their own back yard.

That would be a bummer for U.S. servicemen, though - I had a lot of free trips to Germany and England:)

No shit.

It's good duty.

Beats the Hell out of Iraq and Afghanistan.

And we've pulled a Hell of a lot out already.

Back in the 1960's we had almost as many military in Germany as we have in the whole US Army today.

Because that worked out so well after the 'War to End All Wars'...:rolleyes:

Meaning?

After WWI the US turned isolationist and the Marshall Plan after WWII was success, imo.

Cats is dealing with European capability.

Trump is saying the same.

None of the NATO member states could stand on their own if Putin decided to flex his muscles. I was reading an article recently that stated a large percentage of Swedes favor joining NATO due to concerns that Russia is being their old dickish selves in the Baltic.

Trump? Who cares?

That is not the crux of the matter.
They want US shield without cost to themselves.

The OP is saying it is time for them to step up...to take their hands out of their pockets...to stop going to the bathroom when the tab is on the table.

BTW Uncle Sam is broke. Uncle is heavily in debt.

I may 'ave to break out de Myers dark rum and some lambsbreath for this conversation, old friend. :cool: :D

My pops had a good friendship with those people in old Luxembourg and those Belgians in Bastogne back in WWII.

My point is simply the nations of Western Europe, whether separate entities as NATO members or collectively as the EU, need to bear a proportionate amount of the responsibility and cost for the defense of their borders.

The U.S. will no doubt maintain a European presence and uphold our treaty agreements and alliances, Europe simply needs to be weaned and step out of the nest.

Russia is sabre rattling in the Baltics and pushing the envelope all over to see what it can get away with, but that can be dealt with without the #s we have in Europe and with more commitment from European NATO members.

I don't foresee Russian tank divisions rolling through the Fulda gap any time soon - these days they are more likely to create a civil war and come to the "aid" of the side they are backing - creates more political fog.

Or they just cut off the gas tap.