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-   -   Russian sanctions. (http://www.politicalchat.org/showthread.php?t=7010)

Samm 03-04-2014 06:49 AM

Russian sanctions.
 
Nuland loses control of a Washington coup in Ukraine to replace the political leaders, Kerry threatens Russian troops and orders them out. Then Obama threatens sanctions that would end our roll as reserve currency.
How much longer should the truly stupid be allowed to run out government?
"A senior adviser to Putin said this morning that if the United States were to impose sanctions on Russia over Ukraine, Moscow might be forced to drop the dollar as a reserve currency and refuse to pay off loans to U.S. banks.

As newswires reported the comments from Putin’s senior aide Glazyev, the USD Index fell marginally to session lows and broke below 80.00 before recovering.

Russia could reduce to zero its economic dependency on the United States if Washington agreed sanctions against Moscow over Ukraine, politician and economist Glazyev said, warning that the American financial system faced a "crash" if this happened.

Sergei Glazyev, a senior adviser to President Putin, added that if Washington froze the accounts of Russian businesses and individuals, Moscow will recommend to all holders of U.S. treasuries to sell their U.S. government debt.

Glazyev is often used by the authorities to stake out a hardline stance. He does not make policy but has the ear of Putin and would be aligned with the more hawkish elements in the Russian government and military.

"We would find a way not just to reduce our dependency on the United States to zero but to emerge from those sanctions with great benefits for ourselves," said Kremlin economic aide Sergei Glazyev.

He told the RIA Novosti news agency Russia could stop using dollars for international transactions and create its own payment system using its "wonderful trade and economic relations with our partners in the East and South."

Russian firms and banks would also not return loans from American financial institutions, he said.

"An attempt to announce sanctions would end in a crash for the financial system of the United States, which would cause the end of the domination of the United States in the global financial system,” he added."
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...w/31400020.cms

BlueStreak 03-04-2014 06:50 AM

I see. You are so brilliant. I hang on your every word like a suckling pig at his mothers teat, savoring the sweet and intellectually nourishing milk of your astounding wisdom. Oh, please kind oracle, do go on.

finnbow 03-04-2014 07:06 AM

You look cute in your Putin cheerleader outfit, Samm. However, you're still a shameless shill and a plagiarist, even with your sky blue and red pom-poms.

http://www.goldcore.com/goldcore_blo...nancial_System

Samm 03-04-2014 07:06 AM

You seem to need attention. Im sorry I already raised my kids.
"BlueStreak
This message is hidden because BlueStreak is on your ignore list."

Samm 03-04-2014 07:11 AM

Nuland should be dismissed for stupidity. Assuming she has a secure phone line at an Embassy in the Ukraine? Sad.
They really need to get a new play book if they are going to try taking over democratically elected officials in other countries. This is right out of the 1957 Syrian coup play book.
Michel Chossudovsky, Global Research , January 27, 2012




“In order to facilitate the action of liberative (sic) forces, …a special effort should be made to eliminate certain key individuals. …[to] be accomplished early in the course of the uprising and intervention, …

Once a political decision has been reached to proceed with internal disturbances in Syria, CIA is prepared, and SIS (MI6) will attempt to mount minor sabotage and coup de main (sic) incidents within Syria, working through contacts with individuals. …Incidents should not be concentrated in Damascus …

Further : a “necessary degree of fear .. frontier incidents and (staged) border clashes”, would “provide a pretext for intervention… the CIA and SIS [MI6 should use … capabilitites in both psychological and action fields to augment tension.” (Joint US-UK leaked Intelligence Document, London and Washington, 1957)
http://globalresearch.ca/syria-cia-m...sabotage/29126

Dondilion 03-04-2014 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueStreak (Post 198663)
I see. You are so brilliant. I hang on your every word like a suckling pig at his mothers teat, savoring the sweet and intellectually nourishing milk of your astounding wisdom. Oh, please kind oracle, do go on.

Is there any meat to his post? Is it substantive or just BS?

Samm 03-04-2014 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnbow (Post 198669)
You look cute in your Putin cheerleader outfit, Samm. However, you're still a shameless shill and a plagiarist, even with your sky blue and red pom-poms.

http://www.goldcore.com/goldcore_blo...nancial_System

Very good. Im glad I have you at least doing some research. I cross reference my sources sweetie. Many quote Kremlin economic aide Sergei Glazyev as issuing the same statement. Grow up and learn how to use the internet if you are going to use it.
Probably learning how quotation marks and a link works would be a good start. :D

finnbow 03-04-2014 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198672)
Nuland should be dismissed for stupidity....

Nice source, Samm. Damn, you're an impressionable shill.

Globalresearch.ca (also under the domain name globalresearch.org) may best be described as a left-wing equivalent to WingNutDaily. It is the website of the Montreal-based non-profit The Centre for Research on Globalisation (CRG), founded by Michel Chossudovsky.

The website describes itself as an "independent research and media organization." Globalresearch.ca takes pride in being a reliable "alternative news" source serving as a major repository of a broad range of "news articles, in-depth reports and analysis on issues which are barely covered by the mainstream media" (such as the New World Order). Its politico-economic stance is strongly anti-capitalist, anti-imperialist, anti-militarist, "internationalist but anti-globalization." Its view of science, the economy and geopolitics seems to be broadly conspiracist.

While many of Globalresearch.ca's articles discuss legitimate humanitarian or environmental concerns, the site has a strong undercurrent of reality warping and bullshit throughout its pages, especially in relation to taking its news from "Russia Today", along with other unreliable and/or open sources.

Despite presenting itself as a source of scholarly analysis, Globalresearch.ca mostly consists of polemics many of which accept (and use) conspiracy theories, pseudoscience and propaganda. The prevalent conspiracist strand relates to global power-elites (primarily governments and corporations) and their New World Order. Specific featured conspiracy theories include those addressing 9/11, vaccines, genetic modification, Zionism, HAARP, global warming, and David Kelly. Analyses of these issues tend follow the lines of the site's political biases.

Apparently, contributors to Globalresearch.ca consider information sourced from anyone who seems aligned to their ideology as reliable; during the 2011 Libyan civil war the site was an apologist for Muammar al-Gaddafi, reproducing his propaganda and painting him as a paragon of a modern leader. It's no surprise then that the site has long become a magnet for radicals, fringe figures and crank elements from the left in general. And ironically, it has more in common with its writers' enemies and wingnut rivals than they would ever admit.


http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Globalresearch.ca

finnbow 03-04-2014 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198675)
Very good. Im glad I have you at least doing some research. I cross reference my sources sweetie. Many quote Kremlin economic aide Sergei Glazyev as issuing the same statement. Grow up and learn how to use the internet if you are going to use it.
Probably learning how quotation marks and a link works would be a good start. :D

Plagiarist shill.

Dondilion 03-04-2014 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnbow (Post 198676)
Nice source, Samm. Damn, you're an impressionable shill.

Globalresearch.ca (also under the domain name globalresearch.org) may best be described as a left-wing equivalent to WingNutDaily. It is the website of the Montreal-based non-profit The Centre for Research on Globalisation (CRG), founded by Michel Chossudovsky.

The website describes itself as an "independent research and media organization." Globalresearch.ca takes pride in being a reliable "alternative news" source serving as a major repository of a broad range of "news articles, in-depth reports and analysis on issues which are barely covered by the mainstream media" (such as the New World Order). Its politico-economic stance is strongly anti-capitalist, anti-imperialist, anti-militarist, "internationalist but anti-globalization." Its view of science, the economy and geopolitics seems to be broadly conspiracist.

While many of Globalresearch.ca's articles discuss legitimate humanitarian or environmental concerns, the site has a strong undercurrent of reality warping and bullshit throughout its pages, especially in relation to taking its news from "Russia Today", along with other unreliable and/or open sources.

Despite presenting itself as a source of scholarly analysis, Globalresearch.ca mostly consists of polemics many of which accept (and use) conspiracy theories, pseudoscience and propaganda. The prevalent conspiracist strand relates to global power-elites (primarily governments and corporations) and their New World Order. Specific featured conspiracy theories include those addressing 9/11, vaccines, genetic modification, Zionism, HAARP, global warming, and David Kelly. Analyses of these issues tend follow the lines of the site's political biases.

Apparently, contributors to Globalresearch.ca consider information sourced from anyone who seems aligned to their ideology as reliable; during the 2011 Libyan civil war the site was an apologist for Muammar al-Gaddafi, reproducing his propaganda and painting him as a paragon of a modern leader. It's no surprise then that the site has long become a magnet for radicals, fringe figures and crank elements from the left in general. And ironically, it has more in common with its writers' enemies and wingnut rivals than they would ever admit.


http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Globalresearch.ca

Yes, yes but is the post bullshit?

Samm 03-04-2014 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198673)
Is there any meat to his post? Is it substantive or just BS?

Washington broke the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty and were called out on it last month.
http://larouchepac.com/node/29746

finnbow 03-04-2014 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198682)
Washington broke the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty and were called out on it last month.
http://larouchepac.com/node/29746

Good Lord. Now you're quoting LaRouche. :eek:

Here's another take on one of your favorite sources, shill.

The Centre for Research on Globalization is – how to put it delicately- a Canadian clubhouse for crackpots of the anti-war, 911-truth, anti-imperialist and anti-Zionist variety. The Centre would not normally be worth noticing except for a laugh. But, today is not a normal day.

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/...rld-crumbling/

Samm 03-04-2014 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198681)
Yes, yes but is the post bullshit?

The truth is irrelevant to them. They are to busy handing the power to control their emotions over to a complete stranger who could care less about their childish behavior. I guess they need someone to hate and Im the target of the hour.:rolleyes:
I imagine I would find more tolerance of a an opposing opinion at a KKK meeting.
:D

BlueStreak 03-04-2014 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198673)
Is there any meat to his post? Is it substantive or just BS?

I must agree with whatever the "puppetmaster" says.;)

Dave

finnbow 03-04-2014 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198681)
Yes, yes but is the post bullshit?

Seeing where it comes from and their established relationship with the Russia Today, I'd say it's an article written to strengthen Russia's bargaining position over Crimea. S(h)amm, her paymaster, and her cited websites seem pretty active in this regard.

finnbow 03-04-2014 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198686)
The truth is irrelevant to them. They are to busy handing the power to control their emotions over to a complete stranger who could care less about their childish behavior. I guess they need someone to hate and Im the target of the hour.:rolleyes:
I imagine I would find more tolerance of a an opposing opinion at a KKK meeting.
:D

Worthless shill. You have yet to link to a reputable source in any of your posts. Every single one goes to an interrelated crackpot website.

Miserable shill.

Dondilion 03-04-2014 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198682)
Washington broke the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty and were called out on it last month.
http://larouchepac.com/node/29746

Samm, lets stick to the financial and monetary sanctions for the moment. One does not need to make a case about US involvement in Kiev.

What I am interesting in is the possible effect of Russia's retaliation in the
financial world. Is it substance or just puff? Can you answer that question?
Or can anybody on this board answer that question?

Samm 03-04-2014 07:42 AM

Wow I have a whole slew of dancing puppets this morning. Thanks, this is priceless.
"BlueStreak
This message is hidden because BlueStreak is on your ignore list.

View Post Unread 03-04-2014, 08:36 AM
Remove user from ignore listfinnbow
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View Post Unread 03-04-2014, 08:37 AM
Remove user from ignore listfinnbow
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Dondilion 03-04-2014 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnbow (Post 198689)
Seeing where it comes from and their established relationship with the Russia Today, I'd say it's an article written to strengthen Russia's bargaining position over Crimea. S(h)amm, her paymaster, and her cited websites seem pretty active in this regard.

You still will not answer whether it makes sense or not.

finnbow 03-04-2014 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198693)
You still will not answer whether it makes sense or not.

From the POV of someone who wants to strengthen Russia's bargaining position over Ukraine, yes it makes sense. For those trying to resist Russia's aggression, no. It can easily be read as a lobbying effort to undermine the concerted effort by the West that Russia fears most, something that S(h)amm and her paymasters/mentors seem to support. What you see depends on where you stand.

Samm 03-04-2014 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198691)
Samm, lets stick to the financial and monetary sanctions for the moment. One does not need to make a case about US involvement in Kiev.

What I am interesting in is the possible effect of Russia's retaliation in the
financial world. Is it substance or just puff? Can you answer that question?
Or can anybody on this board answer that question?

Of course it is a real threat and their BRICS partners are in agreement of their response to a threat of sanctions against Russia. If China dumps our debt our position of world reserve currency is over. That is what I have been saying since I got here but some would rather play childish games. I have to assume they have nothing to lose. I do.
http://thebricspost.com/ukraine-cris.../#.UxXZQLmYbIU

finnbow 03-04-2014 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198697)
Of course it is a real threat and their BRICS partners are in agreement of their response to a threat of sanctions against Russia. If China dumps our debt our position of world reserve currency is over. That is what I have been saying since I got here but some would rather play childish games. I have to assume they have nothing to lose. I do.
http://thebricspost.com/ukraine-cris.../#.UxXZQLmYbIU

China agrees with Russia with respect to an armed invasion of its neighbor. Imagine that.:rolleyes:

Feckin' shill.

Dondilion 03-04-2014 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnbow (Post 198696)
From the POV of someone who wants to strengthen Russia's bargaining position over Ukraine, yes it makes sense. For those trying to resist Russia's aggression, no. It can easily be read as a lobbying effort to undermine the concerted effort by the West that Russia fears most, something that S(h)amm and her paymasters/mentors seem to support. What you see depends on where you stand.

In your opinion can it (effect of Russian financial retaliation) occur as stated by the Russian.

finnbow 03-04-2014 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198699)
In your opinion can it (effect of Russian financial retaliation) occur as stated by the Russian.

I'd say "as threatened by the Russians" (and passed along by willing accomplices like S(h)amm). I think any such effort by the Russians would have far greater negative impacts upon their economy than ours or the world's in general. Their economy and their currency are both basket cases. That's why they (and their shills) are making such threats. It's all they got.

It's often said that they're a Third World economy with a First World army.

Samm 03-04-2014 08:02 AM

With BRICS holding the majority of our debt the "leaders" of this country have easily put us in a position of economic collapse globally.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_public_debt

Dondilion 03-04-2014 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198697)
Of course it is a real threat and their BRICS partners are in agreement of their response to a threat of sanctions against Russia. If China dumps our debt our position of world reserve currency is over. That is what I have been saying since I got here but some would rather play childish games. I have to assume they have nothing to lose. I do.
http://thebricspost.com/ukraine-cris.../#.UxXZQLmYbIU

That is the kind of answer I am hoping to get from you.

However I do not think China is going to dump our debt for now.
China is too dependent on our market at this time.

BlueStreak 03-04-2014 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198703)
That is the kind of answer I am hoping to get from you.

However I do not think China is not going to dump our debt for now.
China is too dependent on our market at this time.

Interdependency..........:)

Dave

Samm 03-04-2014 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198703)
That is the kind of answer I am hoping to get from you.

However I do not think China is not going to dump our debt for now.
China is too dependent on our market at this time.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-1...-reserves.html
We are no longer the valuable consumer we once were. It has continued to go down steeply into 2014 but I don't have the updated chart on file.
http://www.shadowstats.com/imgs/2014...5536712694829b

Dondilion 03-04-2014 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnbow (Post 198701)
I'd say "as threatened by the Russians" (and passed along by willing accomplices like S(h)amm). I think any such effort by the Russians would have far greater negative impacts upon their economy than ours or the world's in general. Their economy and their currency are both basket cases. That's why they (and their shills) are making such threats. It's all they got.

It's often said that they're a Third World economy with a First World army.

That means that if there is effective control and will they can easier sustain
assault on the economy.

Currency devaluation is disastrous if you are extremely import dependent.
Russia is huge. This is a chance for the Russians to develop internally.

4-2-7 03-04-2014 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnbow (Post 198698)
China agrees with Russia with respect to an armed invasion of its neighbor. Imagine that.:rolleyes:

Feckin' shill.

By definition you fall to this category as well.

Shill

Samm 03-04-2014 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198711)
That means that if there is effective control and will they can easier sustain
assault on the economy.

Currency devaluation is disastrous if you are extremely import dependent.
Russia is huge. This is a chance for the Russians to develop internally.

Since the EU isn't paying Gazprom what they owe anyway what does Russia have to lose but cutting them off.

Dondilion 03-04-2014 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198709)
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-1...-reserves.html
We are no longer the valuable consumer we once were. It has continued to go down steeply into 2014 but I don't have the updated chart on file.
http://www.shadowstats.com/imgs/2014...5536712694829b

Maybe so, but our market is still a huge one for China. :D

4-2-7 03-04-2014 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finnbow (Post 198701)
I'd say "as threatened by the Russians" (and passed along by willing accomplices like S(h)amm). I think any such effort by the Russians would have far greater negative impacts upon their economy than ours or the world's in general. Their economy and their currency are both basket cases. That's why they (and their shills) are making such threats. It's all they got.

It's often said that they're a Third World economy with a First World army.

I think their having a conversation without you.

Samm 03-04-2014 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4-2-7 (Post 198712)
By definition you fall to this category as well.

Shill

My understanding of a "shill" is someone who is an accomplice in a scam perpetrated on others. I don't really see what they think I have to gain by posting the truth so I have to conclude that they are confused about the definition of what a "shill" actually is. Not really very surprising though. :rolleyes:

Samm 03-04-2014 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198714)
Maybe so, but our market is still a huge one for China. :D

They have replaced our importing with many others and are actually pretty well positioned to continue without us.
For example
http://thebricspost.com/chinas-trade.../#.UxXiMbmYbIU
I also remember reading that they had cornered exports to some "corridor" and I was impressed that it amounted to over 30% of the world population but I cant find that article at the moment. Im in and out of here getting ready for my day.

Samm 03-04-2014 08:31 AM

You might find this article interesting also Don.
http://thebricspost.com/china-asean-.../#.UxXkIbmYbIU

Dondilion 03-04-2014 08:34 AM

In all of this we are not noticing another aspect.

The Europeans refused to pay the tab the former Ukraine government demanded.

The Russians were willing to do so but then everything fell apart.

Now that Kerry is coming to Kiev are we the ones going to take care
of the bill? :D

4-2-7 03-04-2014 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samm (Post 198717)
My understanding of a "shill" is someone who is an accomplice in a scam perpetrated on others. I don't really see what they think I have to gain by posting the truth so I have to conclude that they are confused about the definition of what a "shill" actually is. Not really very surprising though. :rolleyes:


A person who pretends to give an impartial endorsement of something in which they themselves have an interest:

You see this site pedals a far left agenda and ideology by any means necessary.
Spreading propaganda lies and defaming others.

They are the Shills

When another view is presented they try to defame that individual as being the Shill.

4-2-7 03-04-2014 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dondilion (Post 198726)
In all of this we are not noticing another aspect.

The Europeans refused to pay the tab the former Ukraine government demanded.

The Russians were willing to do so but then everything fell apart.

Now that Kerry is coming to Kiev are we the ones going to take care
of the bill? :D

We already have negotiated that though the IMF. Bail-out

d-ray657 03-04-2014 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4-2-7 (Post 198728)
A person who pretends to give an impartial endorsement of something in which they themselves have an interest:

You see this site pedals a far left agenda and ideology by any means necessary.
Spreading propaganda lies and defaming others.

They are the Shills

When another view is presented they try to defame that individual as being the Shill.

I think that you haven't fully thought through application of the definition - even to the facts as you see them. You have not identified the financial interest in those whose ideology is different from yours. What you see as the facts might qualify as partisanship, or even propaganda, but in the absence of a financial motive, what you have described is not shilling.

Regards,

D-Ray


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