9/11 an inside job?
 

I don't think so. I mean, I am no big fan of the Bush & Cheney crew, but I seriously doubt they would go THERE. Would they?

Dave

it's not a banner under which i would leap to march, but the trouble is, today, i just can't categorically deny such a scenario as possible.the stakes are very high for those who are close to major money and power. to think that we don't have some seriously nasty people in this country is to be a fool. such creatures would have little difficulty rationalizing the collateral damage attendant to one of their self defense/promotion schemes. rather than organizing a particular strike, however, i believe these 'devil's disciples' cultivate the ground by their greed and arrogance for the lesser intelligences' hatreds(directed by the superior crowd's propaganda) to blossom into violent actions against the 'enemy'. some of this activity rises to the level of 'conspiracy' and 'plots', but at a level well insulated from the true authors.

yes they would but they did not

Well, what's it gonna be.

Is Bush some hillbilly bumpkin with his shoes on the wrong feet or the mastermind behind 9-11?

Then again, was Cheney pulling the levers while he kept Bush busy writing policy on his Etch-o-Sketch?

Chas

Bush's only involvement was in ignoring all the warnings. that is a far cry from actually planning the whole thing.

Thanks Rob.

When I read folks saying Bush WOULD'VE done it, and then hear them say the teabaggers are nuts, well....

Charles, ain't it funny how Bush is an idiot? He sure kept the Dems tied in knots :D

Here's an article about a missed opportunity. Take a look at the 20th paragraph, it ties in with another topic we've been discussing.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4540958/

Pete

It's all there in the 9/11 Commission Report. The real issue, according to a prominent Republican, is that taxes are too high. Lower taxes would lead to more people traveling. With more people in our air travel system, there would more people, or Citizen Centuries as it were, to watch for terrorists. Had taxes been lower 9/11 would never have happened.

Proof: 9/11 happened before the Bush tax cuts were passed. After they were passed, no more attacks.

Tom Tancredo did disagree with this assessment, however, claiming the real problem was illegals.

Tightwads, lunatics, or both?

Well, while I don't believe 9/11 was done by this crew, it does seem that you have summed up the Bush administration with razor sharp accuracy here, Chas.

Dave

Bush was not a bumpkin. He certainly has no intellectual curiosity either however.
Yes, Cheney pulled the levers, but not on 911. Cheney simply used 911 to his personal advantage after the fact.

I completely agree.

His involvement might have been more substantial than that. Even before taking office he expressed his desire to be a wartime president because as such he would have a freer hand to accomplish his larger agenda. He was even critical of his father for squandering his opportunity in the Gulf War.

It's known that the White House was working on plans for a war against Iraq "from day one", long before Sept. 11. Bush surrounded himself with people his father called "the crazies". Getting control of Mideast oil was a high priority for these guys. Getting Saddam Hussein was a high priority for Bush. It was a marriage made in Hell.

Freudian slip: Operation Iraqi Freedom was first named
Operation
Iraqi
Liberation.

It is believed, but not known, that during Cheney's secret energy meetings Iraq's oil wealth was divvied up among the oil companies attending. Cheney has classified everything about these meetings, even down to times, dates and who was in attendance. We do know, however, that these meetings were held before Sept. 11.

The Neocon think tank The Project For The New American Century (PNAC) authored a paper wherein they recognized that "... the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event––like a new Pearl Harbor". In other words, an event like 9/11 would be useful to them in accelerating the rate of transition to the world they sought. Many members of PNAC, ended up in the Bush Administration. Here's a partial list of signatories to the document I've cited.

Elliot Abrams
John Ellis Bush (Jeb)
Richard B. Cheney
Zalmay Khalilzad
I. Lewis Libby (Scooter)
Donald Rumsfeld
Paul Wolfowitz

Others involved with PNAC:

Richard L. Armitage
John R. Bolton
Linda Chavez
Eliot A. Cohen

All of these except Jeb had high positions in the Administration.

When you couple these facts with the almost unbelievably easy time the highjackers had in hitting us on Sept. 11 it's impossible not to entertain the possibility that bin Laden's attacks were in some way enabled by people in our government, perhaps passively, perhaps actively. I have no firm opinions in this regard but my mind is certainly open.

John

The kid who blows up frogs grows up to blow up countries.

Do a little research and find that Clinton believed Saddam was a threat too - because he was. With the Butcher firing on our planes daily of course we had a plan to invade!

We HAD to get our troops out of Saudi Arabia, the infidels in the holy land Osama was harping about, root causes and all that.

Pete

Check this out - look at the names:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/war/wmdquotes.asp

Not that they all believed in invasion, far from it. But what good is a fine army if you don't use it?

Pete

Every since the passage of the "Patriot Act," I have believed that 9/11 was the best thing that ever happened to the Bush administration, meaning it was, indeed, one of the worst things ever to happen to America.

Regards,

D-Ray

You mean the planes that were flying over Saddam's country harassing his military? Clinton's idea, and the UN's idea, was to contain Saddam. It was working in the sense that Saddam was indeed contained and neutered but the sanctions wreaked a terrible toll on the civilian population.

This one's a real beaut! It was bin Laden who railed against the infidel Crusader army in Islam's holy places. So, after 9/11, what did Bush do? Why, pull our troops out, of course - just like his former business partner's brother insisted.

John

Yeah, but see the UN inspectors and intelligence in our possession from the debriefing of Saddam's defecting son-in-law had all established that Hussein had completely dismantled his WMD program long before we invaded. Saddam was playing games, not allowing that fact to become generally known because he was afraid of his own neighbors, particularly Iran. If they knew how weak he was they might have been emboldened to take him out.

The best use of an army is not to use it. It should serve as a deterrent first and an aggressor last, last, last!

John

The thing that dismays me is the seeming reluctance of the Democrats to roll that POS back or repeal it altogether.

John

That was a treay that he agreed to, after he raped Kuwait.

Root causes. We removed the problem.

I was paraphrasing Albright tongue in cheek: "What's the point of having this superb military that you're always talking about if we can't use it?" M Albright to C Powell

Pete

Well, it was part of the terms imposed on him after his defeat. Not exactly a treaty - but I don't really see a point here.

After 9/11. Brilliant, huh?

Oh, I wasn't familiar with that quote. Ms. Albright isn't one of my favorites. She's a bloodthirsty old bat.

John

That's because they are scared the Republicans will call them weak on the 'war' on terror. They need to remind everyone that the last Republican President to win a war was Teddy Roosevelt.

As it turned out many of the stories that came out about the 'rape of Kuwait' were just that - stories, made from whole cloth.

The Kuwaities were slant drilling into Iraq's oil fields as well. Regardless, while we were 'freeing' them all their able bodied men were boozing it up in Europe.

A war of choice, a war of aggression and a war for empire, with a manufactured excuse for starting it (the USS Maine).

John

I'd say Iraq is won.

We've always been an empire - an 'Empire of Reason'.

Pete

You mean because we took Saddam out and "gave them Freedom & Democracy"?

Pete, c'mon! You can do better than that crap!

John

Iraq will descend into civil war as soon as we leave or shortly thereafter. The Shiites hate the Sunnis and both of them have been screwing the Kurds since heaven knows when.

So what was the reason.:rolleyes:

Honest to God, I would love to know. Why were the so intent on going back into that hell hole? Please, don't give me the WMD crap. And if it was oil, haven't we kind of fucked that up?

No Eddie, I was trying to wrap my poor mind around the "empire of reason" bit, perhaps I should have settled for a chorus or two of Jingo Bells.:D

Empire of Reason is the Founders' term, not mine.

Ever wonder why NY is the 'Empire State'?

Pete

Most of them voted for it in the first place.

Chas

Say Pete, you need to watch using terms from the founders, you may be taken for a constitutionalist.

That kind of shit will get you on the SPLC's widely distributed terrorist watch list...along with gun owners, Ron Paul supporters, ex-military personnel, Sons of Confederate Veterans (only two I know personally are liberal Democrat attorneys), Christians, etc, etc.......

You know, right wing terrorists....probably better than 50% of the population.

Chas

Of course they did. They didn't want to be labelled a tratior in the aftermath of that disaster.

P.S., I'm bad with initials. What is SPLC?

Regards,

D-Ray

Southern Poverty Law Center.

Chas

Chas,

I get the feeling from your overall body of work here, that you would be quite comfortable with Ron Paul. I have to admit that he is an engaging and sincere sounding fellow. The biggest problem with him is that by the time his policies got compromised to death we wouldn't ever have a chance to see if they work.

Regards,

D-Ray

Ron Paul is an interesting sort. Don't really know too much about him other than he's been wanting to audit (and eliminate) the Federal Reserve. I also think he would like to return the US currency to the gold, or some kind of, standard.

Fat chance of that happening, huh?

And I think that he was one of the few who voted against the Patriot Act, because he didn't feel is passed Constitutional muster. I may be wrong on this, but I don't think so.

The last of the dinosaurs...a statesman who will stand on Constitutional principles.

I admire him for this. But being a realist, I recognize that those days are over.

It the brave new world. Personally, I kind of liked chickenshit old world better, but who asked me, huh????

Chas

Yes, and without reading it. They were all afraid of being accused of being "weak on terror". I haven't forgotten and I haven't forgiven them.

Now that they've had a chance to read it, however, I wish they'd do the right thing and get rid of the damned thing.

John

They all like it. They just use it as a bludgeon to beat one another in the head with when the dog and pony show comes around every couple of years.

Chas

So, you're saying NY is an "Empire of Reason"?:rolleyes:

Dave