The Grand Bargain? or is it The Grand Swindle?
 

There are rumblings in the progressive world that Pres. Obama wants to fashion a "Grand Bargain" with the Repubs to avoid this so-called looming fiscal cliff. It sounds like the shit end of the stick to me for the economic engine in this country, the middle class. What have you all heard?

So far, I've heard nothing beyond what I've heard from you.

In the WaPo this AM it said that he is going for a bigger tax increase on the top 2% than was in his last budget.

Bob, are you saying Obama's selling out already? :p

Or would that be sold :eek:

Pete

Still in the bubble, eh?:rolleyes:Have a nice Thanksgiving this year, it'll be your last.:D

I KNEW it! I KNEW it! Obama's gonna outlaw religion!

:D

Pete

Thanksgiving isn't about religion, Pete. It never has been. You're confusing Father Christmas and the Easter Bunny with the back handed thanks we give to native Americans every year around this time.

I for one would be happy to see this paganistic fake christianity that is a pox on our country, go away.;)

We're Giving Thanks - to the Injuns? :p

Pete

They don't want your thanks. They want their country back.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5xVRXLgLxw

John

No sound here, sorry.

Pete

Then get back to work!

John

Yes sir lol. (Right now I'm on hold)

Pete

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thanksgiving

Fer a smart feller you don't seem to know much about our history...:p

Our long history of giving thanks to God? ;)

Pete

In grade school we were taught that Thanksgiving celebrated the Indians teaching the Puritans to live off the land. Apparently they didn't have grains, fowl, bread, or tubers in the old country and were waiting around for rustic job creators to show them what to do before they starved.

Now to see if that is what wiki says . . .

We included the Indians because we were still friendly then (if that's even true!). The feast itself was literally giving thanks to God. Thanks-giving.

It is (was) a long tradition. Here's a nice one: http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/gwhtml/gw004.html

Pete

From the wiki you referenced-

"Historically, Thanksgiving had roots in religious and cultural tradition."

What has come to be known as the first Thanksgiving was probably more of a harvest festival. By the time they started calling it Thanksgiving, it was certainly a religious celebration. If you're giving thanks, you're giving it to an entity. They thanked God before every meal, so technically it was always Thanksgiving.

So much for what the Army taught us in grade school.

Thanks to God makes more sense anyway. It must have been a good feeling when crops survived to harvest.

That's what I was taught. The Puritans were a sorry and starving lot after that first winter and then the locals (Natives) taught them how to grow corn, dropping a dead fish as fertilizer in the hole with the seed.

Still parsing up a storm, eh Was?

From the Wiki
"In the United States, the modern Thanksgiving holiday tradition is commonly, but not universally, traced to a poorly documented 1621 celebration at Plymouth in present-day Massachusetts. The 1621 Plymouth feast and thanksgiving was prompted by a good harvest."

Thanks to the local Natives for teaching them how to farm sucessfully here.
Here's another Wiki for ya, Was.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thanksg...(United_States)

Pretty much a secular holiday from the start. Despite what you want to believe, Was.

There sure is some parsing going on.

Pete

Without the House, O has to sell something.

No, shit.

I will take a wait and see approach for now. According to my Brother In law (Tbagger) he was one "angry ****er" today at the news conference.


Barney

Hi Barney, That is my stance, too. I've spent a bit of time watching the news today and my assessment is that President Obama today was the man that we voted for. If the House doesn't play ball, I have one response, 2014. If the Repubs want to re-fight this election at the mid terms? Bring it...:cool:.
Besides the delicious infighting amongst the Old Guard and the Tea Party - the so called Chicago machine is still in place and far from letting down their guard. Yeah, we are celebrating but come Monday we will stow our bongs, vapes and merlot and what have you and get down to it.

To be honest I'm still of the opinion that politicians are mostly full of sh*t, it boils down to the degree of it and who will look out for the health and welfare of the United States. It's obvious to me that Obama is the right guy for the job but he also needs the electorate at his back and at his feet with the kindling ready should he need a reminder of his mission.;)