If Iran feels they need nukes, who could blame them?

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by neophyte

within this thought lies the essence of the fallacy of America's view of the rest of the world. We're American, we're christian, ergo, we will decide what is best for you and your country, impose our will upon you, and bludgeon you until you see the light of wisdom that shines so brightly on us.

Allow? Really?

America does not, by any tenet, measure, or interpretation of international law have the authority to allow, disallow, or otherwise steer and influence a damned thing Iran or any other nation decides is in their best interests. We presume to occupy some mythical moral high ground because we embrace the rule of law, then discard it whenever it doesn't suit our ends or purposes.

Giving full measure to the validity of our cause and purpose in WW2, here's the key to it all. There was a time and place in history for America to assume the role of the benevolent dictator, but it ended over a half century ago.

Until we, as a nation and people, grasp the concept of staying the fuck out of other peoples ways of life,business, and governments, we will be despised for just what we are, and suffer from the resulting hostility.

Peace is a virtual impossibility in this world with a jackbooted bully mashing the throats of those that won't comply with it's wishes, and we are wearing those boots.

Wow!

I would give it a plus one, because in theory I agree. However, in todays reality, I believe you either dominate, or you are dominated. I can agree, that with our tendency to support ruthless dictators in the name of "protecting our interests", we have made some staunch enemies.

But, tell me;
What do you think would we face if we simply withdrew into isolationism now? Would our present enemies back down and leave us be? Or would they go on the offensive?

My guess is the latter.

I'm afraid the die is already cast. Yes, we've been dancing a sinister dance. But if we don't protect ourselves from real and present enemies, they will come to collect the bill.

Dave

[neophyte]

they have nearly a century of meddling, manipulation and exploitation on which to build a solid foundation of hate for America and Great Britain, and they have done. Anyone remotely familiar with these circumstances, coupled with a remarkable grasp for the obvious gets why we are there sworn enemies. We made this bed, and now we lay in it.

Ah, but this is where the dominant dog factor comes onto play. They are not over here, dictating to us----Because we are the dominant dog.

Iran has deduced,very correctly, the fact that they become a dog much less likely to be fucked with if they have nukes. They might not become the alpha male right away, but, they will immediately become a dog to be very, very wary of.

[finnbow]

What many Americans fail to realize is that the animus of the Iranians against the US is based upon our (with Britain's assistance) orchestrating a coup against their first democratically elected leader in 1953. They don't "hate us because of our freedoms," as the GOP would have you believe. It has much more to do with us deposing their democratically elected leader so that we could maintain control over their oil, while installing the Shah and his very nasty secret police, SAVAK. It could be very easily argued that we're responsible for the Ayatollahs ultimately taking control.

[Bigerik]

Originally Posted by finnbow

What many Americans fail to realize is that the animus of the Iranians against the US is based upon our (with Britain's assistance) orchestrating a coup against their first democratically elected leader in 1953. They don't "hate us because of our freedoms," as the GOP would have you believe. It has much more to do with us deposing their democratically elected leader so that we could maintain control over their oil, while installing the Shah and his very nasty secret police, SAVAK. It could be very easily argued that we're responsible for the Ayatollahs ultimately taking control.

I thought I posted at length about that recently. Didn't seem to sink in that time. Hopefully it will this time.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by Bigerik

I thought I posted at length about that recently. Didn't seem to sink in that time. Hopefully it will this time.

Jeez, you had the answer the whole time and I wuz too stoopid to get it.

And here I wuz thinking they hated us because of our freedoms!!!

Chas

[Bigerik]

Originally Posted by Charles

Jeez, you had the answer the whole time and I wuz too stoopid to get it.

And here I wuz thinking they hated us because of our freedoms!!!

Chas

Stick around long enough, and you will learn that is frequently the case.

[Bigerik]

Iran has been meddled with constantly over the past hundreds of years. As it was mostly the Brits and the Russians doing it, the obvious candidate to turn to for help was Germany. Interesting reading on the Constitutionalist monarchy movement in Iran, and what the foreigners did against it.

[Bigerik]

Wow. Strong post!

[merrylander]

All we have to do is stay out of the area, between the Sunni and the Shia they will likely manage to kill themselves off given the opportunity. I just hope we left enough armaments with the Kurds.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by merrylander

All we have to do is stay out of the area, between the Sunni and the Shia they will likely manage to kill themselves off given the opportunity. I just hope we left enough armaments with the Kurds.

Be nice if we could, or WOULD.

Should of been developing our own energy resources for years now instead of remaining reliant on the Middle East.

I suppose there is just too much money involved in keeping things as they are.

Chas