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  #11  
Old 11-20-2009, 11:28 AM
noonereal noonereal is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merrylander View Post
Bush's only involvement was in ignoring all the warnings. that is a far cry from actually planning the whole thing.
I completely agree.
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  #12  
Old 11-20-2009, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merrylander View Post
Bush's only involvement was in ignoring all the warnings. that is a far cry from actually planning the whole thing.
His involvement might have been more substantial than that. Even before taking office he expressed his desire to be a wartime president because as such he would have a freer hand to accomplish his larger agenda. He was even critical of his father for squandering his opportunity in the Gulf War.

It's known that the White House was working on plans for a war against Iraq "from day one", long before Sept. 11. Bush surrounded himself with people his father called "the crazies". Getting control of Mideast oil was a high priority for these guys. Getting Saddam Hussein was a high priority for Bush. It was a marriage made in Hell.

Freudian slip: Operation Iraqi Freedom was first named
Operation
Iraqi
Liberation.

It is believed, but not known, that during Cheney's secret energy meetings Iraq's oil wealth was divvied up among the oil companies attending. Cheney has classified everything about these meetings, even down to times, dates and who was in attendance. We do know, however, that these meetings were held before Sept. 11.

The Neocon think tank The Project For The New American Century (PNAC) authored a paper wherein they recognized that "... the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event––like a new Pearl Harbor". In other words, an event like 9/11 would be useful to them in accelerating the rate of transition to the world they sought. Many members of PNAC, ended up in the Bush Administration. Here's a partial list of signatories to the document I've cited.

Elliot Abrams
John Ellis Bush (Jeb)
Richard B. Cheney
Zalmay Khalilzad
I. Lewis Libby (Scooter)
Donald Rumsfeld
Paul Wolfowitz

Others involved with PNAC:

Richard L. Armitage
John R. Bolton
Linda Chavez
Eliot A. Cohen

All of these except Jeb had high positions in the Administration.

When you couple these facts with the almost unbelievably easy time the highjackers had in hitting us on Sept. 11 it's impossible not to entertain the possibility that bin Laden's attacks were in some way enabled by people in our government, perhaps passively, perhaps actively. I have no firm opinions in this regard but my mind is certainly open.

John

The kid who blows up frogs grows up to blow up countries.
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  #13  
Old 11-20-2009, 12:41 PM
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Do a little research and find that Clinton believed Saddam was a threat too - because he was. With the Butcher firing on our planes daily of course we had a plan to invade!

We HAD to get our troops out of Saudi Arabia, the infidels in the holy land Osama was harping about, root causes and all that.

Pete
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  #14  
Old 11-20-2009, 12:54 PM
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Check this out - look at the names:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/war/wmdquotes.asp

Not that they all believed in invasion, far from it. But what good is a fine army if you don't use it?

Pete
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  #15  
Old 11-20-2009, 12:55 PM
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d-ray657 d-ray657 is offline
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Every since the passage of the "Patriot Act," I have believed that 9/11 was the best thing that ever happened to the Bush administration, meaning it was, indeed, one of the worst things ever to happen to America.

Regards,

D-Ray
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  #16  
Old 11-20-2009, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piece-itpete View Post
Do a little research and find that Clinton believed Saddam was a threat too - because he was. With the Butcher firing on our planes daily of course we had a plan to invade!
You mean the planes that were flying over Saddam's country harassing his military? Clinton's idea, and the UN's idea, was to contain Saddam. It was working in the sense that Saddam was indeed contained and neutered but the sanctions wreaked a terrible toll on the civilian population.

Quote:
We HAD to get our troops out of Saudi Arabia, the infidels in the holy land Osama was harping about, root causes and all that.
Pete
This one's a real beaut! It was bin Laden who railed against the infidel Crusader army in Islam's holy places. So, after 9/11, what did Bush do? Why, pull our troops out, of course - just like his former business partner's brother insisted.

John
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  #17  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by piece-itpete View Post
Check this out - look at the names:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/war/wmdquotes.asp
Yeah, but see the UN inspectors and intelligence in our possession from the debriefing of Saddam's defecting son-in-law had all established that Hussein had completely dismantled his WMD program long before we invaded. Saddam was playing games, not allowing that fact to become generally known because he was afraid of his own neighbors, particularly Iran. If they knew how weak he was they might have been emboldened to take him out.

Quote:
Not that they all believed in invasion, far from it. But what good is a fine army if you don't use it?
Pete
The best use of an army is not to use it. It should serve as a deterrent first and an aggressor last, last, last!

John
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  #18  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d-ray657 View Post
Every since the passage of the "Patriot Act," I have believed that 9/11 was the best thing that ever happened to the Bush administration, meaning it was, indeed, one of the worst things ever to happen to America.

Regards,

D-Ray
The thing that dismays me is the seeming reluctance of the Democrats to roll that POS back or repeal it altogether.

John
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  #19  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:25 PM
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piece-itpete piece-itpete is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boreas View Post
You mean the planes that were flying over Saddam's country harassing his military? Clinton's idea, and the UN's idea, was to contain Saddam. It was working in the sense that Saddam was indeed contained and neutered but the sanctions wreaked a terrible toll on the civilian population.
That was a treay that he agreed to, after he raped Kuwait.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boreas View Post
This one's a real beaut! It was bin Laden who railed against the infidel Crusader army in Islam's holy places. So, after 9/11, what did Bush do? Why, pull our troops out, of course - just like his former business partner's brother insisted.
Root causes. We removed the problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boreas View Post
The best use of an army is not to use it. It should serve as a deterrent first and an aggressor last, last, last!

John
I was paraphrasing Albright tongue in cheek: "What's the point of having this superb military that you're always talking about if we can't use it?" M Albright to C Powell

Pete
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  #20  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by piece-itpete View Post
That was a treay that he agreed to, after he raped Kuwait.
Well, it was part of the terms imposed on him after his defeat. Not exactly a treaty - but I don't really see a point here.

Quote:
Root causes. We removed the problem.
After 9/11. Brilliant, huh?

Quote:
I was paraphrasing Albright tongue in cheek: "What's the point of having this superb military that you're always talking about if we can't use it?" M Albright to C Powell

Pete
Oh, I wasn't familiar with that quote. Ms. Albright isn't one of my favorites. She's a bloodthirsty old bat.

John
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