Pope John Paul's Beatification ....

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

Is there a purpose for this thread other than to bash religion, or Catholics, or both?

I was just remarking on the beatification ritual and the willingness of Rome to glom on to the nun's story with the supporting rationale of "there is no explanation using current scientific knowledge" and therefore it must have been the result of prayers to the dead Pope.

Somehow this causality seems just a little suspect to me. Just sayin'.

It's kinda like saying that my sore throat feels better this morning. It must be because I played Led Zeppelin last night.

To me (born and raised Catholic), it seems that it is a foregone conclusion that the Church wants John Paul to be a saint. Now they're beating the bushes for stuff to support it (even if the evidence is specious).

If you choose to believe it, fine. I'll take my evidence well-done, thank you.

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

I was just remarking on the beatification ritual and the willingness of Rome to glom on to the nun's story with the supporting rationale of "there is no explanation using current scientific knowledge" and therefore it must have been the result of prayers to the dead Pope.

That's why they call it "faith."

Also, there are other alleged examples of individuals asking for JP's intercession, and seeing their prayers answered.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/religio...es_26_ST_N.htm

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by whell

That's why they call it "faith."

Also, there are other alleged examples of individuals asking for JP's intercession, and seeing their prayers answered.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/religio...es_26_ST_N.htm

And do you actually believe such stuff? If so, you're in no position to criticize Muslim terrorists expecting dozens of virgins IMHO.

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

And do you actually believe such stuff? If so, you're in no position to criticize Muslim terrorists expecting dozens of virgins IMHO.

You're right, of course. One should have no reason to hope their love life is any better in heaven than it is on Earth.

So, you're suggesting that those who might attribute a favorable outcome to their prayers for a cure to their own affliction or for the improved health of a loved one to their God or thier religious beliefs are no better than a blood-thirsty terrorist? That's an interesting, and I hope singular, perspective.

[d-ray657]

I think that there is a difference between bashing religion and questioning the rituals, questioning the assertions, and questioning the way people interpret religious texts. Honestly evaluating myself, I am religious, but not devout. I don't believe that people who don't believe the same as I do are going to Hell. I respect the right of others to profess their own faith, or to profess no faith at all. The beliefs of another don't diminish my beliefs, and I don't intend to take action to diminish another's beliefs. If I do happen to live my life in a way that causes other people to inquire into my beliefs, I will share what I believe and why. Unfortunately, I doubt too many would see me as a role model.

Regards,

D-Ray

[whell]

Originally Posted by d-ray657

I don't believe that people who don't believe the same as I do are going to Hell.

I guess then that there must be other reasons why folks always tell me to go to hell.

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by whell

I guess then that there must be other reasons why folks always tell me to go to hell.

if you need any help in understanding why they tell you this just pm me and i'll explain

[d-ray657]

Originally Posted by whell

I guess then that there must be other reasons why folks always tell me to go to hell.

If an atheist told you that, would it really be cursing?

Regards,

D-Ray

[whell]

Originally Posted by d-ray657

If an atheist told you that, would it really be cursing?

Regards,

D-Ray

I dunno, but I've not noticed a difference in sentiment....

[JonL]

I am unabashed in my bashing of religion. It is superstition at best and a tool for exploitation and destruction at worst. Sure, there have been and continue to be many good and charitable actions done by religious organizations and individuals, but that charity can just as easily exist without the mantle of religion. And that charity does not outweigh the waste of time and outright damage done by and in the name of religion.

Religion exists because human beings are smart enough to recognize the concepts of past and future, birth and death, finite and infinite, but not smart enough to truly understand those concepts. Human beings for some reason believe we are smart enough to understand everything in the world around us, and when presented with concepts that exceed our ability to understand (infinity, what happens when one dies, what happened before the universe existed, etc...) we invent a solution (God) so we don't have to face the fact that we are still humble animals with limitations on our intelligence.

You can call that bashing, I call it reality. What's bashing? Things like the Crusades, the Holocaust, Jihadism, and the genocidal atrocities we have seen in our own generation in Bosnia and Africa. Those are what I call "bashing." Not some stupid, meaningless chatter on a silly internet forum.