Obama clears up the name game

[Wasillaguy]

Originally Posted by icenine

OP

I think ISIS or ISIL is the translation of what they call themselves not an invention on our part. They do not call themselves Daesh...that is what other Muslims call ISIS.

So who is giving them more credibility? Those who call them what they call themselves? Or those who call them terrorists and radicals?

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by Wasillaguy

So who is giving them more credibility? Those who call them what they call themselves? Or those who call them terrorists and radicals?

Obama's point is that it doesn't matter what you call them. There is no magic word that will make ISIS shrivel up and go away. It's a GOP fantasy and a distraction. In WWII, Germans were called Nazis, Jerries, Huns, Krauts and many other names. The semantics didn't matter. Actions on the battlefield did.

[Pio1980]

How the namecalling affects relations and cooperation with Islamic allies is what matters. Offending them by implied association is counterproductive.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[MrPots]

There are those who don't care who they offend..and then they blame the offended for being offended instead of looking in the mirror and seeing assholes.

[icenine]

Originally Posted by Wasillaguy

So who is giving them more credibility? Those who call them what they call themselves? Or those who call them terrorists and radicals?

It is a name for a terrorist group. The whole world knows them as ISIS. Just like everyone knew who the NAZIs were. The issue is not giving them credibility. The name is the title of an organization that has had control of significant parts of Iraq and Syria for the last three years. Your contention that anyone who calls them ISIS is condoning them or legitimizing them is ridiculous beyond words. Just because we call them ISIS does not mean we are in way giving them a boost.
If you had cancer it would be no less deadly if you refused to call it cancer. You could call it an uncontrolled multiplication of abnormal cells but it will still kill you in the end.

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by Wasillaguy

I finally understand. Obama won't call them "radical Islamists", he says because it's not valid as they don't represent Islam and they just want us to use that terminology to goad us into a war against an entire religion. But then he immediately calls them ISIL, which stands for the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant.
So he's calling them Islamic as well. That means it must be the "radical" part that he doesn't like. If he didn't like the "Islam" part, he wouldn't call them ISIL either.

No Was they are calling themselves ISIL so how the hell else would anyone know who he was talking about if he did not call them that? Mind you he could say Daesh

[whell]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Obama's point is that it doesn't matter what you call them. There is no magic word that will make ISIS shrivel up and go away. It's a GOP fantasy and a distraction. In WWII, Germans were called Nazis, Jerries, Huns, Krauts and many other names. The semantics didn't matter. Actions on the battlefield did.

I don't think there's much doubt about what's going on here. Whether or not Obama and his administration uses the specific words "radial Islam" isn't critical. Obama knows that, Trump knows that, everyone knows that.

What is critical is being clear about who the enemy is: clearly identifying who he believes the enemy is. The admin's messaging on this is muddled and designed to avoid offending folks. He complicates that by raising red-herrings in his speech yesterday (ie., Should we keep US citizens under surveillance? We already do!).

There is Islamic terrorism in the world, and the US is a target. We've already had a number of domestic Islamic terrorist acts the have occurred under Obama's watch, yet the administration in minimizing how the perpetrators of these incidents are characterized. He continued that with his speech yesterday regarding Mateen, yet the investigation is still under way and we don't have all the facts.

Couple that with the comments of Obama's village idiot DHS Director - "We need to build a bridge". Tell that to the families of the dead, Jeh.

[icenine]

Originally Posted by whell

I don't think there's much doubt about what's going on here. Whether or not Obama and his administration uses the specific words "radial Islam" isn't critical. Obama knows that, Trump knows that, everyone knows that.

What is critical is being clear about who the enemy is: clearly identifying who he believes the enemy is. The admin's messaging on this is muddled and designed to avoid offending folks. He complicates that by raising red-herrings in his speech yesterday (ie., Should we keep US citizens under surveillance? We already do!).

There is Islamic terrorism in the world, and the US is a target. We've already had a number of domestic Islamic terrorist acts the have occurred under Obama's watch, yet the administration in minimizing how the perpetrators of these incidents are characterized. He continued that with his speech yesterday regarding Mateen, yet the investigation is still under way and we don't have all the facts.

Couple that with the comments of Obama's village idiot DHS Director - "We need to build a bridge". Tell that to the families of the dead, Jeh.

What about a system that lets someone buy an AR-15 in less than an hour?

[donquixote99]

Originally Posted by whell

Couple that with the comments of Obama's village idiot DHS Director - "We need to build a bridge". Tell that to the families of the dead, Jeh.

Shall we make this into as big a fight as possible, so millions die? Will 'the families of the dead' feel better then?

Shut up about the 'families of the dead,' you do not own them to use in your rhetoric.

Trying to make political points by making fun of efforts toward peace is banal and evil.

[whell]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

Shall we make this into as big a fight as possible, so millions die? Will 'the families of the dead' feel better then?

Shut up about the 'families of the dead,' you do not own them to use in your rhetoric.

Trying to make political points by making fun of efforts toward peace is banal and evil.

Islamic terrorists are the tip of the iceberg, or the tip of the spear if you prefer. Those leveraging Islam for violence/war would surely like to make this as big a fight as possible, and have said so a number of times.

As far as your admonition to "shut up", please follow your own advise. Obama didn't hesitate to stand on the bodies of the dead when he decided to use the occasion of the Orlando shooting to advance his political agenda and call out his political rivals. Maybe that's were you need to direct your comments first.