Are your papers in order sir?

[Boreas]

Originally Posted by rickr15

Funny the Mexican Govt makes such a stink on this. Last time I got sent down to check the process at a maquiladora we did business with in Mexico we went through 20 some checkpoints each of which we were ordered out of the car by heavily armed and armored federales and had to show papers and were often searched anyway. Hypocrites for sure.

BTW look into how Mexico treats illegals from their Southern borders.

What the hell does Mexican law have to do with the US Constitution?

Face it. This AZ law is indefensible. The problem is real enough but the "solution" is unworkable, unduly invasive and unconstitutional.

We're gradually morphing probable cause into "reasonable suspicion" in this country, not just in immigration law but everywhere. That's the real problem.

John

[Fast_Eddie]

Originally Posted by rickr15

Funny the Mexican Govt makes such a stink on this. Last time I got sent down to check the process at a maquiladora we did business with in Mexico we went through 20 some checkpoints each of which we were ordered out of the car by heavily armed and armored federales and had to show papers and were often searched anyway. Hypocrites for sure.

BTW look into how Mexico treats illegals from their Southern borders.

So we should be more like Mexico. Got it.

[rickr15]

Originally Posted by Boreas

What the hell does Mexican law have to do with the US Constitution?

Face it. This AZ law is indefensible. The problem is real enough but the "solution" is unworkable, unduly invasive and unconstitutional.

We're gradually morphing probable cause into "reasonable suspicion" in this country, not just in immigration law but everywhere. That's the real problem.

John

Nothing. Just pointing out the hypocrasy since they are doing so much screaming.
If the fed doesn't get off their ass they are going to have 50 of these state laws to muddle through. What makes you think you had any rights anyway? Didn't the "patriot" act repeal most of them anyway?

[Fast_Eddie]

Originally Posted by rickr15

Didn't the "patriot" act repeal most of them anyway?

No one knows. No one knows what's in the Patriot act. No bills can be read or understood.

[rickr15]

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

No one knows. No one knows what's in the Patriot act. No bills can be read or understood.

Well they do admit that it repeals the law of Habeus Corpus.
Scares me.

[Fast_Eddie]

Originally Posted by rickr15

Well they do admit that it repeals the law of Habeus Corpus.
Scares me.

Nope. No one knows. They don't actually read the bills. Saw it on a commercial. They rammed that healt care bill through at lightning speed. Only took a year. And every time the Republicans changed on clause they all had to start over at page one reading again. They rammed it through. It was on a commercial, so it's true. They don't let them advertise stuff that's not true you know. It's never been read and never will be read. If you try to find it on the internet you'll get a bill, but how do you know that's really the actual bill? They might post one thing but actually sign something else.

I heard that Pilosi an Reed pulled a fast one with the Health Care bill and added a bunch of stuff witout telling anyone. They're the only ones who know about it being there. In 2014 all guns will be illegal. It's in there and the President signed it. No one knows because no one can read the bill.

[piece-itpete]

Enjoying yourself Eddie?

Pete

[Fast_Eddie]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

Enjoying yourself Eddie?

Pete

Actually, yes.

[whoaru99]

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

_ Makes it a crime under state law to be in the country illegally by specifically requiring immigrants to have proof of their immigration status. Violations are a misdemeanor punishable by up to six months in jail and a fine of up to $2,500. Repeat offenses would be a felony.

Isn't it already illegal for someone other than a US citizen to be in the country without the proper paperwork/ID?

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

_ Requires police officers to "make a reasonable attempt" to determine the immigration status of a person if there is a "reasonable suspicion" that he or she is an illegal immigrant. Race, color or national origin may not be the only things considered in implementation. Exceptions can be made if the attempt would hinder an investigation.

I'm guessing that being from the area, the cops that will enforce this probably have a pretty good idea of who really needs to be checked and who doesn't.

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

_ Allow lawsuits against local or state government agencies that have policies that hinder enforcement of immigration laws. Would impose daily civil fines of $1,000-$5,000. There is pending follow-up legislation to halve the minimum to $500.

I don't see a problem here. If I personally obstruct the law I know there can/will be penalties.

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

_ Targets hiring of illegal immigrants as day laborers by prohibiting people from stopping a vehicle on a road to offer employment and by prohibiting a person from getting into a stopped vehicle on a street to be hired for work if it impedes traffic.

Seems pretty hard to enforce much on this but, over all, a simplistic approach to what's essentially been proposed anyway through various forms of status verification for employement.

Originally Posted by Fast_Eddie

So, it *requires* proof that you're an American. If you're walking down the street, it is now illegal in AZ to do so without proper identification. Do you have identification that proves you're an American? As I understand it, you could be arrested without such documentation on your person.

Again, we've all agreed that the police can from time to time over step their authority. Do you really want to give them this power? Look at a cop the wrong way and he can drag you in under this law.

This law not only suggests, but "requires" officers to profile based on race.

How 'bout this- it's illegal to hire someone to work for you regardless of their citizenship. It's illegal to stop and ask a homeless guy if he wants to help you dig up a shrub. A crime for that homeless guy to getting in your car and working for you. Does that really sound like America?

It sounds like a State fed up with illegal immigration trying to make it a point that illegals should think twice about taking up in Arizona.

[Boreas]

Originally Posted by whoaru99

Isn't it already illegal for someone other than a US citizen to be in the country without the proper paperwork/ID?

Yes, but there are a few problems here. First, being here illegally, though illegal, isn't a crime. You can't be incarcerated for being here illegally, just deported. Second, the 14th Amendment reserves immigration matters to the Federal authorities. For a state to enact a law like Arizona's usurps Federal authority and imposes criminal penalties on an offense that isn't one under the relevant Federal statutes.

John