Anyone else see the inconsistency? - Page 3

ebacon · #21 09-19-2012, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oerets

Ahhh intervention only matters when it comes to procreation and by the interpretation of celibate men. But to keep on alive when sick is a totally different matter!

Barney

Now you're just being a simple minded dick that's trying to save face. Intervention for killing and intervention for healing are two different things. You know it, I know it, so stop it.

Oerets · #22 09-19-2012, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ebacon

Now you're just being a simple minded dick that's trying to save face. Intervention for killing and intervention for healing are two different things. You know it, I know it, so stop it.

OK then you do see a difference in having mans intervention in medical procedures. One is OK to healing but not for the creation of another life. We just disagree on the killing portion. I can not say for sure when life first starts or ends. Neither can you also. We just have our own strong feelings and I would not try to change yours.

But if one believes in a afterlife then tell me how an abortion or in vitro really changes an innocents soul? My personal beliefs are more a reuse of the soul somewhere else. Like a rain drop when it leaves the cloud lives a life when falling then is added to the ocean once the fall is over. All to be repeated over and over again.

Barney

piece-itpete · #23 09-20-2012, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oerets

If one really believed this 100% then why go to a Doctor when sick at all. Take medications or get glasses. One should think a Creator enabled us with the tools to have control over our life's.

Barney

We are to do God's work - 'I have made you fishers of men'

Pete

ebacon · #24 09-20-2012, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oerets

OK then you do see a difference in having mans intervention in medical procedures. One is OK to healing but not for the creation of another life. We just disagree on the killing portion. I can not say for sure when life first starts or ends. Neither can you also. We just have our own strong feelings and I would not try to change yours.

But if one believes in a afterlife then tell me how an abortion or in vitro really changes an innocents soul? My personal beliefs are more a reuse of the soul somewhere else. Like a rain drop when it leaves the cloud lives a life when falling then is added to the ocean once the fall is over. All to be repeated over and over again.

Barney

One of my friends is a Catholic priest. While we have never discussed this issue I have learned an important lesson from him: There are no right answers to this kind of stuff.

People will do what people will do. The church cannot stop them. All the church does is provide guidance to help people make the best choices they can.

The same applies to the Instruction paper at hand. As with all documents, it is important to read this document as it was intended. The FOREWORD provides context. Here it is in pertinent part.

Quote:

FOREWORD

The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith has been approached by various Episcopal Conferences or individual Bishops, by theologians, doctors and scientists, concerning biomedical techniques which make it possible to intervene in the initial phase of the life of a human being and in the very processes of procreation and their conformity with the principles of Catholic morality. The present Instruction, which is the result of wide consultation and in particular of a careful evaluation of the declarations made by Episcopates, does not intend to repeat all the Church's teaching on the dignity of human life as it originates and on procreation, but to offer, in the light of the previous teaching of the Magisterium, some specific replies to the main questions being asked in this regard.

Emphasis added.

The Foreward shows that the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith did not publish the paper out of the blue. What actually happened was a number of people were confused on the topic. Those people asked the Congregation for Instruction. Nor does the paper purport to be perfectly aligned with all previous teachings. What it does do, however, is present the Congregations' best answers to the questions that believers asked.

As for your differences with the church, take it up with them. I doubt that you will make headway with a position that it is OK to kill people just to more quickly recycle souls through happy space. Everyone knows that is the Marines job.

Boreas · #25 09-20-2012, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

We are to do God's work - 'I have made you fishers of men'

Pete

That quote refers only to spreading the word.

By the way, Christian Scientists practice essentially the sort of "health care" Barney describes.

John

piece-itpete · #26 09-20-2012, 08:54 AM

They're kinda cultish group IMO, but to each their own. I mentioned the fishers to explain why Christians do go to the doctor etc.

Pete

Boreas · #27 09-20-2012, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

They're kinda cultish group IMO, but to each their own. I mentioned the fishers to explain why Christians do go to the doctor etc.

Pete

Fishermen go to the doctor?

Pete, the scriptural quote was spoken to Peter and the other fishermen in the boat. It was after a disastrous day of fishing where every cast of the nets came back empty until Jesus cast a net which came back bursting with fish.

He was telling them that they must go out and spread God's word among the gentiles, to catch up souls in the "net" of the Word. It has nothing to do with going to the doctor or even just plain caring for ourselves.

John