Humanism has the answers

[watsup1000]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

The bog problem with Soviet Russia, I submit, was not humanism, it was totalitarianism. Stemmed from the foundation of the state by angry nihilistic revolutionaries, who sought to annihilate all power and institutions in society not subservient to themselves, and succeeded all too well.

Humanism was, for them, just one of their weapons.

I would think that true "Humanism" was not actually practiced in Soviet Russia. As you say, it was a perverse corruption of "Humanism" in the name of Communist totalitarianism.

In matter of fact, the primary government/nation that has been underwritten by Humanist principles is the United States. The Constitution if one of the most important Humanist documents in the history of mankind. Granted, there were errors, but that is what Humanism is all about: a continuing dialogue to find the correct answers to ethical considerations.

Quite different from religion, which basically claims to have an "absolute" answer to moral questions based on "holy books" that were supposedly "inspired" by divine guidance. Thus, the Bible was "thumped" to justify slavery in the Old South and to justify the attacks on gays at the present time.

[Tom Joad]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

Worse than Soviet Russia?

Pete

From the perspective of a white man such as yourself, probably not.

[piece-itpete]

One problem with humanism as the start of the US - their whole underling argument was that certain rights were god given. If we were all created equal, how can one man have the divine right to rule another? It's a great argument imo.

If you define history as the story of humans - which it is - I'd trust humans as far as I can toss TJ

From what I've read the same or greater number of slaves died in the Atlantic crossing than in Hitlers camps. It's a very nice thing that they are both history.

Pete

[donquixote99]

Jefferson's evocation of a creator is a thin veneer of theological grounding for rights the enlightenment thinkers found inherent in humanity.

The American revolutionaries were fairly certain that no one, as an individual, had a divine right to rule others. As a class, or as a race, opinions varied.

[nailer]

Humanism is the current pinnacle of us worshipping ourselves.

[watsup1000]

Originally Posted by nailer

Humanism is the current pinnacle of us worshipping ourselves.

Not really. It has nothing to do with "worshipping". It is simply and ACKNOWLEDGEMENT that we, as humans, have the RESPONSIBILITY to develop the ethical codes that will allow us to live together in a civilized manner. As such, we do NOT have to "worship" anything other than a dialogue that will lead to ethical conduct that will be of greatest value.

[watsup1000]

One problem with humanism as the start of the US - their whole underling argument was that certain rights were god given. If we were all created equal, how can one man have the divine right to rule another? It's a great argument imo.

While the Declaration of Independence does indeed refer to such the intervention of a divinity into the deeds of men, the Constitution, the real foundation of the new nation, does not give any indication that it depends upon such a concept. In fact, the Deists such as Benjamin Franklin initiated the conversations that kept such references from being inserted into the Constitution. It thus becomes perhaps the most important HUMANIST document of the period, perhaps right up to today. It was not perfect, but that is what happens when compromise is involved.

[bobabode]

Originally Posted by nailer

Humanism is the current pinnacle of us worshipping ourselves.

You've been living in Texas for too long Bob.

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by donquixote99

The bog problem with Soviet Russia, I submit, was not humanism, it was totalitarianism. Stemmed from the foundation of the state by angry nihilistic revolutionaries, who sought to annihilate all power and institutions in society not subservient to themselves, and succeeded all too well.

Humanism was, for them, just one of their weapons.

^^^What he said.^^^

Dave

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by piece-itpete

One problem with humanism as the start of the US - their whole underling argument was that certain rights were god given. If we were all created equal, how can one man have the divine right to rule another? It's a great argument imo.

If you define history as the story of humans - which it is - I'd trust humans as far as I can toss TJ

From what I've read the same or greater number of slaves died in the Atlantic crossing than in Hitlers camps. It's a very nice thing that they are both history.

Pete

Many of the "Founders" didn't really believe that "all men" were created as equal in the context that we do. They didn't see "Negroes" or women as "men". From all I've read, they apparently only saw themselves as being "men".

A few, such as Adams, saw it differently and were verbally assailed for it. He was one of the few that didn't own any "negro" slaves or servants.

This morning I read up on the building of D.C. and how, despite the fact that he thought the grandeur of the capital was a "fitting seat for government", he bemoaned realizing why "the Southerners" insisted that the capital be built in the south;

The massive use of slave labor and his suspicion that they were receiving kickbacks from construction contractors.

But, I am told we should return to the "honorable" and "Christian" ways of the Founders..........

LOL!

Dave