Smoking ban

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by finnbow

1. Force employees to breath second-hand smoke as a condition of employment?
2. Exclude certain classes of people from their business (e.g., blacks, gays, Hispanics) because it's private?
3. Slap pornography up all over the walls (not a strip club, but a normal bar/restaurant).

In some cases, public good trumps private rights. Just sayin'.

1) This is of course the strongest argument. I see it as no different than accepting a job at a coal mine or a nail salon. both clearly not health environments.

2) We are not talking about who can patronize a restaurant or bar we are talking about those who may seek employment there. Apples and oranges. (yet a clever argument )

3) Well this is a different conversation but why should porn not be allowed? I think this is ridiculous. For me it's about labeling. Leave the country free to do as one wishes but protect society by labeling so it knows what it is getting. Then we maintain our freedom to choose and don't have exposures we do not want. Just like with the media. News shows should be labeled as such and political activist shows should be labeled as such.

[Boreas]

Originally Posted by Combwork

Bit like the emissions tests on car exhausts, a lambda sensor built into the filter outlet could check and record partical levels. These get checked say once every couple of months or so. Occasionally going a little over the threshold gets a warning, regular low threshold failure gets a fine. Regular high level failure gets the bar closed down. Tampering with the sensor gets the bar closed down and the owner prosecuted.

Needs a little tweaking. The lambda sensor (actually probably an array of them) would need to be located in the general environment. Mounting it in the filter outlet would monitor the air being extracted, not the air being breathed.

Also, this is merely a monitoring system. What happens to chronic violators? Must they ban smoking or close? Eventually this would result in a de facto smoking ban unless there was some way to filter out or neutralize the smoke being introduced into the environment.

John

[d-ray657]

When I used to travel more, the smoking ban on airplanes helped me quit. The airport would have an enclosed smokers' ghetto that really reeked of stale smoke. It made flights much more enjoyable to not have a nagging nicotine urge halfway through the flight.

BTW Grumpy, how are the smokeless cigs going? Does anyone know if the no-smoking laws affect them? I remember there being something like them about 20-25 years ago, but they suddenly disappeared from the shelves.

Not smoking just gives me one less vice to deal with. Now if they would ban chocolate . . . I wouldn't have to take responsibility for my own actions.

Regards,

D-Ray

[rickr15]

Hardest habit I ever quit.
But I think more and more people are doing it. I believe 10 years ago the percentage of adults who smoke was closer to 35%.

[Boreas]

Anyone remember those lettuce cigarettes? Supposed to be safe I think. I tried one once. Tasted like shit.

Oh, wait! They're back!

http://www.bravosmokes.com/

John

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by Boreas

Anyone remember those lettuce cigarettes? Supposed to be safe I think. I tried one once. Tasted like shit.

Oh, wait! They're back!

http://www.bravosmokes.com/

John

Yeh, but they keep going out when I put salad dressing on 'em.

[rickr15]

Originally Posted by Boreas

Anyone remember those lettuce cigarettes? Supposed to be safe I think. I tried one once. Tasted like shit.

Oh, wait! They're back!

http://www.bravosmokes.com/

John

No but I remember the clove ones back in the 80's. Never did much for me.

[piece-itpete]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Yeh, but they keep going out when I put salad dressing on 'em.

Lmao!!

Pete

[Combwork]

Originally Posted by Boreas View Post
Needs a little tweaking. The lambda sensor (actually probably an array of them) would need to be located in the general environment. Mounting it in the filter outlet would monitor the air being extracted, not the air being breathed.

It's not a perfect solution, but monitoring the filter outlet would check whether the filter's doing it's job and putting clean air back in the bar. Thinking about it though, the system would be reactive, not preventative. To be preventative I guess you'd need a large inlet over a small smoking area, moving large volumes of air slowly enough so the fan noise doesn't get too odtrusive. I feel like I'm shooting myself down here but when catalytic converters, lambda sensors etc. were first proposed for cars, a lot of people said they just wouldn't be practical either.

Also, this is merely a monitoring system. What happens to chronic violators? Must they ban smoking or close? Eventually this would result in a de facto smoking ban unless there was some way to filter out or neutralize the smoke being introduced into the environment.

That's what I'm after, filtering out say 90% of the smoke produced. I'm not saying it would be easy for a bar owner to do this. As things stand in the U.K., bar owners are expected to police their premises; it's them who get the heavy fines if they allow their customers to smoke anywhere undercover.

I don't smoke; haven't done for 30 years but the creeping "you can't do that any more" bothers me. Will there come a time when despite most cars having cigarette lighters, nobodies allowed to smoke in them? Unless of course it's a convertible

I've just had a pop-up (doesn't happen much these days) telling me this message was too short to post.

Combwork

[Grumpy]

Originally Posted by finnbow

In Maryland (or maybe just Montgomery County, MD), the smoking ban in bars and restaurants was justified as an occupational safety and health issue (i.e., not exposing employees to the hazards of second hand smoke). On its face, it had nothing to do with the patrons. That said, as a non-smoker, I'm good with it.

And that was exactly how they passed the laws here. Said it was to protect the employee. We all know that's BS.

Being second class ain't so bad.