Putin Invades the Ukraine

[Not Insane]

Originally Posted by Chicks

Pootin's Puppet again praises Putin moments before Russia launches invasion of Ukraine

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-aga...042841605.html

Disgusting pig. You'd have to be as stupid as the Insane Clown to still support this traitor.

I think you are missing the point. He's saying that, if you put yourself in Putin's shoes, his being pretty shrewd in how he is acting in his country's best interests on the international stage.

One key ingredient to finding peace with your adversary is to "know thy enemy". It's why we blew it with Hitler (the seeds of the rise of the German Nazi party were sown with the Treaty of Versailles). It's important to see your enemy not as just "the bad guys" (something often done in political arguments on social media and forums), but as people like you, that have wants, needs, a patriotic pride, etc. This allows one to at least understand what Putin is doing and why. We "dehumanize" our political/military foes at our peril.

And in this interview is a great rundown of what's going on and what has brought us to where we are today:

"What does Russia Want"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYK4UGS-C0I

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by Not Insane

I think you are missing the point. He's saying that, if you put yourself in Putin's shoes, his being pretty shrewd in how he is acting in his country's best interests on the international stage.

One key ingredient to finding peace with your adversary is to "know thy enemy". It's why we blew it with Hitler (the seeds of the rise of the German Nazi party were sown with the Treaty of Versailles)...

Hitler's ideology was largely based upon a 1916 book by the American author Madison Grant, The Passing of the Great Race, which Hitler referred to as "his Bible" for its views on the exalted "Nordic race" and the need for racial purity. It was published 3 years prior to the Treaty of Versailles.

FWIW, it remains the Bible for America's NeoNazi movement per Richard Spencer, one of America's most prominent NeoNazi's (and outspoken Trump fanboy).

As for "we blew it with Hitler," Hitler launched WWII over 2 years before we entered it (as a result of Pearl Harbor). Blaming the USA for Hitler or Putin is profoundly stupid and dismisses their own culpability.

[Not Insane]

Originally Posted by finnbow

Hitler's ideology was largely based upon a 1916 book by the American author Madison Grant, The Passing of the Great Race, which Hitler referred to as "his Bible" for its views on the exalted "Nordic race" and the need for racial purity. It was published 3 years prior to the Treaty of Versailles.

FWIW, it remains the Bible for America's NeoNazi movement per Richard Spencer, one of America's most prominent NeoNazi's (and outspoken Trump fanboy).

As for "we blew it with Hitler," Hitler launched WWII over 2 years before we entered it (as a result of Pearl Harbor). Blaming the USA for Hitler or Putin is profoundly stupid and dismisses their own culpability.

I agree very much with the first part of your post. However, by "we" I meant the rest of Europe and also the US. And by "Hitler", I really meant Germany. Sorry about the imprecision in that last part. When I said "rise of the Nazi's", implied was the rise of Hitler.

BTW, Associating Trump with Spencer is like associating vegetarians, tea totallers or dog lovers with Hitler.

[nailer]

Originally Posted by Not Insane

I agree very much with the first part of your post. However, by "we" I meant the rest of Europe and also the US. And by "Hitler", I really meant Germany. Sorry about the imprecision in that last part. When I said "rise of the Nazi's", implied was the rise of Hitler.

BTW, Associating Trump with Spencer is like associating vegetarians, tea totallers or dog lovers with Hitler.

Say what you mean and mean what you say. Although, I think most understood what you were implying. You have to remember, finnbow thinks Trump is another Hitler, I'm a big time Trump supporter, and Putin isn't a good strategist and tactitian.

[Not Insane]

Originally Posted by nailer

Say what you mean and mean
What you say.

My posts are not college theses. They are forum posts. It's water cooler conversation, peppered with links. I clarified when it was apparent I caused confusion.

That's how conversations work.

[nailer]

Originally Posted by Not Insane

Greater minds than ours have this same disagreement. I was making a blanket statement, trying to avoid the weeds. I've been a student of the rise and fall of the Nazi party in Germany since the late 60's, when I was in high school. It's always fascinated me - to this day.

Originally Posted by Not Insane

My posts are not college theses. They are forum posts. It's water cooler conversation, peppered with links. I clarified when it was apparent I caused confusion.

That's how conversations work.

See a contridiction?

[Not Insane]

Originally Posted by nailer

See a contridiction?

Nope. I'd rather you not make this thread about me, though. I'm not paying you rent, no matter how hard you try.

[finnbow]

Originally Posted by nailer

Say what you mean and mean what you say. Although, I think most understood what you were implying. You have to remember, finnbow thinks Trump is another Hitler, I'm a big time Trump supporter, and Putin isn't a good strategist and tactitian.

There's no question that Trump admires authoritarians and despots of all stripes, from Hitler to Kim to Xi to Putin and that his beliefs, tactics and ideology greatly resemble the NSDAP in the early 1930's.

As for you being a Trump supporter, I'd call you more of a contrarian. As for Putin as strategist and tactician, I really haven't spoken to that. He is, however, a malign force in this world and is determined to undermine democracy and the West.

[nailer]

Originally Posted by finnbow

There's no question that Trump admires authoritarians and despots of all stripes, from Hitler to Kim to Xi to Putin and that his beliefs, tactics and ideology greatly resemble the NSDAP in the early 1930's.

As for you being a Trump supporter, I'd call you more of a contrarian. As for Putin as strategist and tactician, I really haven't spoken to that. He is, however, a malign force in this world and is determined to undermine democracy and the West.

Actually you have, my clearly stated point about Putin being how good he is as a strategist and tactition. Nothing contrarian about this given his results so far. 1)Tzar of all the Russia's. 2) Crimea. 3... He's on a roll.

[nailer]

Originally Posted by Not Insane

I think you are missing the point. He's saying that, if you put yourself in Putin's shoes, his being pretty shrewd in how he is acting in his country's best interests on the international stage.

One key ingredient to finding peace with your adversary is to "know thy enemy". It's why we blew it with Hitler (the seeds of the rise of the German Nazi party were sown with the Treaty of Versailles). It's important to see your enemy not as just "the bad guys" (something often done in political arguments on social media and forums), but as people like you, that have wants, needs, a patriotic pride, etc. This allows one to at least understand what Putin is doing and why. We "dehumanize" our political/military foes at our peril.

And in this interview is a great rundown of what's going on and what has brought us to where we are today:

"What does Russia Want"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYK4UGS-C0I

Your Versailles seed analogy is weak. The NAZI's blamed the WWI defeat, symbolized by said treaty, on traitorous Jews, thus creating a demon to rally around. The treaty was plant food for the seeds. Now, the Traité de Saint-Germain-en-Laye [url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Saint-Germain-en-Laye_(1919)][/url was a seed: "As the Austrian national identity did not exist and develop prior to 1945, people had German national consciousness. Article 88 of the treaty required Austria to refrain from directly or indirectly compromising its independence, which meant that Austria could not enter into political or economic union with the German Reich without..." this is why Ansclush was such big deal. Hitler had united the German race. With this Hitler had the people behind him an the rest is history.