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[Combwork]

Originally Posted by merrylander

The part I don't get is this "winning the hearts and minds" crap. I don't care if they hate me, but if they knock down more buildings maybe we should level a few cities.

The odds on winning the hearts and minds of thos savages are similar to the future of a snowball in hell.

"The odds on winning the hearts and minds of thos savages are similar to the future of a snowball in hell."

Maybe you're right but we've got to try. Trying solely for a military solution against people whose leaders have indoctrinated them to the point where they consider it an honor to die just isn't going to work.

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by Combwork

"The odds on winning the hearts and minds of thos savages are similar to the future of a snowball in hell."

Maybe you're right but we've got to try. Trying solely for a military solution against people whose leaders have indoctrinated them to the point where they consider it an honor to die just isn't going to work.

I don't got to do a damn thing as far as muslims are concerned, they have insulted my wife on four separate occasions, and that was four to many. The next SOB that tries it may not survive.

[Combwork]

Originally Posted by merrylander

I don't got to do a damn thing as far as muslims are concerned, they have insulted my wife on four separate occasions, and that was four to many. The next SOB that tries it may not survive.

No problem Merrylander, that was indeed four too many but lets turn this around. Because some Muslims are extremists, should all Muslims be condemned? What the terrorists do is way beyond anything in the Koran, although like the Bible bits of it are ambiguous enough to be twisted to suit their needs.

How would the USA react if in order to avenge dead civilians, schoolchildren, hospital patients etc. Islamic extremists managed to destroy an American city or two? If your family were killed by an enemy who then said "hey, shit happens in war; collateral damage" how would you or your descendants react?

The IRA were murderers who tortured then killed anyone who were against them but eventually, like them or loath them (I loath them) we HAD to sit and talk. Keeping it to a military level, it took thousands of deaths plus two A bombs to beat the Japanese into submission. Would you personally go that far to try to destroy Islamic radicals or eventually, maybe through gritted teeth, sit down and talk? If the latter, would it not be better to do it now rather than later; to work with moderate Muslims to try to isolate extremists, or is anyone wearing a Burka a legitimate target?

[merrylander]

Originally Posted by Combwork

No problem Merrylander, that was indeed four too many but lets turn this around. Because some Muslims are extremists, should all Muslims be condemned? What the terrorists do is way beyond anything in the Koran, although like the Bible bits of it are ambiguous enough to be twisted to suit their needs.

How would the USA react if in order to avenge dead civilians, schoolchildren, hospital patients etc. Islamic extremists managed to destroy an American city or two? If your family were killed by an enemy who then said "hey, shit happens in war; collateral damage" how would you or your descendants react?

The IRA were murderers who tortured then killed anyone who were against them but eventually, like them or loath them (I loath them) we HAD to sit and talk. Keeping it to a military level, it took thousands of deaths plus two A bombs to beat the Japanese into submission. Would you personally go that far to try to destroy Islamic radicals or eventually, maybe through gritted teeth, sit down and talk? If the latter, would it not be better to do it now rather than later; to work with moderate Muslims to try to isolate extremists, or is anyone wearing a Burka a legitimate target?

Only two points;

It turns out that the Taliban who was engaged in talks was a fake, and
Where are all those moderate muslims, I am deafened by their condemnation of extremists.

On another tack, General Franks screwed up at Tora Bora else it all would have ended there, and going into Iraq was a criminal (and unecessary) act.

The next one who cames after us will get his head blown off.

[d-ray657]

Originally Posted by Combwork

No problem Merrylander, that was indeed four too many but lets turn this around. Because some Muslims are extremists, should all Muslims be condemned? What the terrorists do is way beyond anything in the Koran, although like the Bible bits of it are ambiguous enough to be twisted to suit their needs.

How would the USA react if in order to avenge dead civilians, schoolchildren, hospital patients etc. Islamic extremists managed to destroy an American city or two? If your family were killed by an enemy who then said "hey, shit happens in war; collateral damage" how would you or your descendants react?

The IRA were murderers who tortured then killed anyone who were against them but eventually, like them or loath them (I loath them) we HAD to sit and talk. Keeping it to a military level, it took thousands of deaths plus two A bombs to beat the Japanese into submission. Would you personally go that far to try to destroy Islamic radicals or eventually, maybe through gritted teeth, sit down and talk? If the latter, would it not be better to do it now rather than later; to work with moderate Muslims to try to isolate extremists, or is anyone wearing a Burka a legitimate target?

Excellent post sir. The power of radical Islam in the ME is most dangerous because it arises from the mixture of religion and government, not the nature of the religion itself. No religion should be judged by the action of it's most radical proponents, nor should any other group of humans. The only persons I really have a problem are corporations.

I don't doubt that bombs and invading forces increases the appeal of the radical ideas.

Regards,

D-Ray

[mossbacked]

Originally Posted by Combwork

"The odds on winning the hearts and minds of thos savages are similar to the future of a snowball in hell."

Maybe you're right but we've got to try. Trying solely for a military solution against people whose leaders have indoctrinated them to the point where they consider it an honor to die just isn't going to work.

I think what some are trying to say is that if it's an honor for them to die, perhaps we will simply have to honor them with some hydrogen.

Because looking at it from the reverse perspective, they too want to win OUR hearts and minds. If that can't effect that, they attempt to kill us in the largest numbers they can muster. It's good that we can ultimately "muster" more than they can.

[Charles]

Originally Posted by mossbacked

I think what some are trying to say is that if it's an honor for them to die, perhaps we will simply have to honor them with some hydrogen.

Because looking at it from the reverse perspective, they too want to win OUR hearts and minds. If that can't effect that, they attempt to kill us in the largest numbers they can muster. It's good that we can ultimately "muster" more than they can.

You're correct, they want us to be just like them.

Myself, I want 'em to take their cut and then go lie down and lick their nuts.
There's no percentage in overturning the applecart.

Chas

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by Charles

You're correct, they want us to be just like them.

Just like Sarah?

[piece-itpete]

Reminds me of the invading aliens on the Simpsons trying to figure out why the humans hate them - one says 'but we won their hearts and minds' while holding out a heart and brain

Pete

[piece-itpete]

Only if you're a Dem!

Pete