I'm interested in the conservative take on this

[beej]

I truly am an Independent and wish to remain that way. Increasingly, however, the Republican Party's seemingly inexorable migration to the right coupled with what I see as an increasing intransigence on matters where it would appear compromise is called for has given me pause. The following appeared in my local paper yesterday. I read it yesterday and then again this morning. I truly am interested in the views of my fellow political posters, particularly on the right, with respect to this piece. Thanks.

http://www.theday.com/article/20120808/OP03/308089954

[beej]

Oh and if, for some reason, you can't open the link, I have the text saved.

[piece-itpete]

Partisan hack piece beej

I'm not a tea partier but respect them. I'll tell you why: they really are grass roots. I know a couple locally and they keep their nose to the grindstone.

I also believe it's time for a serious shakeup in Washington. Our finances are in an unsustainable mess. There are no serious insiders taking it on - they're up to their necks in the status quo.

It's going to get worse.

Pete

[beej]

Thanks for your perspective, Pete.

[piece-itpete]

I get thanked for prattling on? What a great place

You're always welcome

Pete

[icenine]

Pete and the Tea Party always talk about "shaking up Washington" and getting America's financial house in order, the latter always being a good goal. However when you talk in specifics, the Tea Party has no solutions. They do not want their Social Security taken away nor do they want the medicare "they paid for" (after being mandated by the Federal Goverment through involuntary payroll deductions) taken away either. In short government welfare when it benefits them is totally acceptible. Many do even know that they enjoy these so************************tic aspects or our mixed economy.
There is also this misconsception that the government's financial system is like their individual household budget. In other words they do not know that the United States is the largest economic power in the world with 300 billion people and dominates the world economy with THE world currency, the US dollar. Basically a total lack of understanding of what the term macroeconomic means.
Then take you and I, Beej. We are both huge walking entitlements....being retired military we get a pension and basically free health care ....free for us, not the taxpayer,many of whom do not have health care themselves. The Tea Party will not ever think of cutting that aspect of our safety net.
My take is that the Tea Party is basically the old right wing we have always known with a dash of racism thrown in because Obama is black. I know that will upset many people here. But after he leaves office and there is either a white GOP or Dem president the white face signs and the Don't Tread On Me flags will go away quietly, as many Tea Party start to enjoy Obamacare for themselves.
Oh yeah one of posters here is always talking about government getting to big but at the same time praises Bush's Iraqui war policy. Well you need a big government with a big military to run the world. Do not want to mention names
I think it comes down to anger. I am sure if the unemployment rate was lower there would be less anger out there. And I also think many people are ignorant about how the United States is unique...I think many people did not listen in history class and were asleep duing the civics courses. That is why you get people like Sharon Angle, Michelle Bachman, Issa and Keyes being able to dupe the electorate and win primary and general elections. It is sad someone as intelligent and productive as Snowe is leaving the Senate.

[mezz]

A little bored today so here goes...

BTW, Pete is right on and I agree with his post 100%. Here's my long winded version (in case anyone else of bored today too...).

You can let the Tea Party's image be concocted by all the liberal sources you like, but you won't have anything near an accurate picture of what they tend to be about. While this largely is a loose movement forming a faction more aligned with the right than the left, it is not a 'party' nor is it a 'wing' of the Republican Party as the author states. I'm not sure exactly what kind of 'independent' you are, but in my experience (my brother's been a hardcore independent for years and we talk lots of politics), The Tea party is right up his alley.

Harrop isn't a conservative and as such clearly misses the entire point of The Tea Party and the conservative movement and is able to see the GOP only through the same lense as a Washington insider (she does this on purpose though). The motivation of the TP is not to play political games and conduct business as usual in Washington, but to stand on principle and advance conservative causes by implementing practical conservative initiatives which liberals will surely consider 'radical'.

Liberals, and Washington-insider-business-as-usual establishment Democrats, unsurprisingly feel threatened by The Tea Party (as Washington-insider-business-as-usual type Republicans do too) because refusing to compromise one's principles or sell out ones political positions for expediency, votes or personal career advancement simply threatens the way they operate and opposes their politics with a force which is potentially powerful enough to facilitate change and leave them on the sidelines.

This fear and this desire to protect the establishment in Washington is what leads the liberal media to portray the Tea Party as something nasty. A lot of liberals are also addicted to hearsay and have stopped thinking (reevaluating their political positions when presented with new facts) to the point where they'll latch onto the sentiments being promoted by the media and allow themselves to be indoctrinated into sharing these fears.

The Tea Party is the idealistic 'grass roots' movement/faction of the larger conservative movement. It is actually more characteristic of the true liberal movement which surfaced decades ago when idealistic liberals broke from the establishment Democratic Party of the day. That movement based on liberal ideals has completely dissappeared these days although liberals still try to cling to the idea that is is alive and well (although of course they can't point to it - Obama isn't it as much as they were hopelessly hoping that he was).

So why should Froma Harrop care about The Tea Party and/or why would a liberal like her be concerned about The Tea Party dividing and weaking the GOP. Well she isn't concerned about that, in fact she'd like to see that happen. The truth is that Harrod, other liberals and the establishment on both sides of the aisle are legitimately scared of the power the Tea Party could (and does) weild as a movement based firmly in ideology. That is where real leadership and political change come from (not from empty Obama promises). So while the Republicans who are conservatives agree with the ideals and are only threatened on a job security level, liberals and democrats oppose the same ideals and are thus compelled to try to keep down the Tea Party movement in any way they can because they are scared shitless of the repercussions on all levels. That is where Harrop is coming from and that is what I think of this article - from the perspective of a conservative who is not active with the Tea Party but is sympathetic to their ideals and is generally respectful and admiring of their achievement and their earnest efforts thus far.

[beej]

Thanks for what I would characterize as a thoughtful and comprehensive response, icenine. And I, sir, am well aware that I am a walking entitlement although some would call a military retirement pension deferred compensation. I, too, mourn the imminent departure of Olympia Snowe.

[beej]

Thank you, mezz, for your comprehensive response, as well. Oh, and the kind of Independent I am is one who doesn't subscribe to anyone's party line. I call things as I see them. The first presidential election in which I was eligible to vote was 1968 and I voted for Humphrey. Subsequently, I voted for the following Republicans: Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford, Ronald Reagan (twice), Bush the First (once).

[icenine]

Originally Posted by beej

Thanks for what I would characterize as a thoughtful and comprehensive response, icenine. And I, sir, am well aware that I am a walking entitlement although some would call a military retirement pension deferred compensation. I, too, mourn the imminent departure of Olympia Snowe.

I do not mean to imply that we did not earn it. But I just sort of see it that way from my own experience as a military retiree. I really feel bad for those that lost limbs from Iraq and Afganistan, and we need to give as much as we can to our vets. But many like myself have come through pretty much unscathed, but I am not saying we did not make sacrifices. I feel bad though that Americans without the same benefits I have our supporting me with their tax dollars.