Chevy and Chrysler what can be done

[Independent]

Originally Posted by Grumpy

Do we save or let chips fall where they may.

Let the chips fall!

You know, if the previous administration and the present one would have said NO to ALL the bailouts, this country would end up in a LOT better shape than it will eventually end up being in.......




Indy

[wintermuted]

Originally Posted by Independent

You know, if the previous administration and the present one would have said NO to ALL the bailouts, this country would end up in a LOT better shape than it will eventually end up being in......

How so?

I'm no fan of the bailouts and I at least partially share your pessimism about their end effectiveness.

So let's play "what if?". What if our last two respective regimes would have played hardball with all the businesses who have been given a handout?

What would the end results have been in the long and short term, in your eyes?

[Independent]

Originally Posted by wintermuted

How so?

I'm no fan of the bailouts and I at least partially share your pessimism about their end effectiveness.

So let's play "what if?". What if our last two respective regimes would have played hardball with all the businesses who have been given a handout?

What would the end results have been in the long and short term, in your eyes?

Just for starters, how about less taxes as a result of NOT bailing them out for us, for our children, and for our childen's children, etc. Where did all that bailout money come from, and how are we going to pay it back?




Indy

[noonereal]

Originally Posted by Independent

Just for starters, how about less taxes as a result of NOT bailing them out for us, for our children, and for our childen's children, etc. Where did all that bailout money come from, and how are we going to pay it back?




Indy

The corps that borrowed the money are going to pay it back, with interest.
The money came principally from China.

[simi]

Originally Posted by wintermuted

How so?

I'm no fan of the bailouts and I at least partially share your pessimism about their end effectiveness.

So let's play "what if?". What if our last two respective regimes would have played hardball with all the businesses who have been given a handout?

What would the end results have been in the long and short term, in your eyes?

I think if we lost two auto makers at one time, the domino effect would have been huge... could you imagine what things would be like if they along with many massive financial companies were to have fallen around the same time?

A lot of support companies and industries that supply their needs would be hitting the streets and failing too. This place could be looking a lot worse had SOME of the bailouts not have happened... Others could have failed though. They just suqandered the money..

I'm still waiting for the next shoe personally. A country can't be so indebt, and the government hanging onto too much business interest without some sort of big change coming down the road.... I just hope it's not during my time... life hasn't been so bad since the last big changes, next one could be.

[kretinus]

I really don't think people who advocate the hands off approach really look at the big picture or have a unrealistic idea of how the economy works today.

On the other hand handing billions to banks with no strings was probably one of the more stupid ideas to come out of Washington when the people we handed it too have no ones interests but their own at heart.

If you think the tax bill for this will be worse than the ramifications of doing nothing, then I suggest you rethink things a bit deeper and consider all aspects of what would occur.

Most of the people I hear saying hands off also denied any problems to begin with.

[Independent]

Originally Posted by kretinus

I really don't think people who advocate the hands off approach really look at the big picture or have a unrealistic idea of how the economy works today.

Most of the people I hear saying hands off also denied any problems to begin with.

Nope, I see the big picture and I also realized there were problems to begin with, although most, if not all of those problems were self-induced, and what better way to correct them than to let tham fail and start all over. Learn the lesson and move on. The main lesson everyone is learning now is, it's okay fail because someone will bail us out? Corporate welfare must end now before the U.S. government owns everything.....





Indy

[kretinus]

If you think this nation could survive just the economic impact of letting all these companies fail, then I suggest you really aren't looking at the big picture.

Then again if we let it crash, who ends up on top? The very people who crashed it in the first place, only then they would have total control.

Not my idea of what our forefathers envisioned.

Of course all this partsan BS isn't helping when both sides share equal blame and now stand in the way of getting back on track.

[Independent]

Originally Posted by kretinus

If you think this nation could survive just the economic impact of letting all these companies fail, then I suggest you really aren't looking at the big picture.

Is this the first time a few large corporations have failed all at once? No. Will it be the last time? No. What usually happens after someone like Chrysler and GM fail? People start buying Fords, Toyota's, Honda's etc. Where are they being built? Right here in the good old U.S.A. Will the surviving companies need to hire more people to keep up with their new demand? More than likely. Will "new" U.S. automakers come into the picture? Probably. Will they be better and more efficient companies to keep up with the other surviving companies? Yes, or they will fail too.

This same scenario has been played out several hundred times since things have been being built and sold for profit. Our ancestors survived it, and we will too, it's all part of the way things work. Sometimes you have to take a step backward to move two ahead.

Stockholder and executive greed, along with corporate complacency, has caused a great deal of turmoil to this great industrial nation of ours, and unless something gets done about it, like the collapsing of a few industrial giants to wake us up, nothing will ever change, and that, IMHO, would be our biggest mistake.





Indy

[Independent]

Originally Posted by simi

I think if we lost two auto makers at one time, the domino effect would have been huge... could you imagine what things would be like if they along with many massive financial companies were to have fallen around the same time?

A lot of support companies and industries that supply their needs would be hitting the streets and failing too. This place could be looking a lot worse had SOME of the bailouts not have happened... Others could have failed though. They just suqandered the money..

I'm still waiting for the next shoe personally. A country can't be so indebt, and the government hanging onto too much business interest without some sort of big change coming down the road.... I just hope it's not during my time... life hasn't been so bad since the last big changes, next one could be.

The U.S. auto industry is small potatoes compared to the U.S. housing industry and nobody bailed anybody out there. Do you know how many companies and privately held businesses have failed, or gone under, because of the collapse of the housing industry? IMHO, if one or the other "had" to fail, I would have definitely picked the auto industry. And don't get me wrong, I'm against any bailouts, my point here was to explain how insignificant the auto industry is compared to some of the "larger picture" industries such as housing.





Indy