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  #11  
Old 11-26-2013, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noonereal View Post
"trickle down" is a euphemism for "piss on"
You mean that gentle warm yellow rain isn't manna from on high?
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  #12  
Old 11-27-2013, 01:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueStreak View Post
I love everyone in my own mean, sarcastic way. Yes, even Catholics. It's just that they finally have a Pope who's bold enough to tell his flock that American style Conservatism runs afoul of Gods word.

So, if you came upon Jesus and he said he was hungry, tired and naked, you'd tell him "Go get a job you f**king bum!"?

I think you need to reassess the basic nature of your ideology and the glaring way it conflicts with the teachings of Christ. You've been fed a pack of absurd lies by the likes of St. Ronnie and the Church of Righteous Greed.

Dave
Your assumptions, while dramatic, don't reflect my attitude at all. Your cynical stereotype of the cruel, selfish individualist is I'm sure a convenient outlet to direct your anger.
The facts, however, stand in bold contrast to your view. Capitalist, Christian, free enterprise based societies are by far the most charitable, with the highest levels of volunteerism.
I don't expect you to understand or believe what you can't see for yourself though. I just do what I can and have faith that I'm trying to serve my God as he taught, while recognizing I will fall short of the mark, and am forgiven.
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  #13  
Old 11-27-2013, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wasillaguy View Post
Your assumptions, while dramatic, don't reflect my attitude at all. Your cynical stereotype of the cruel, selfish individualist is I'm sure a convenient outlet to direct your anger.
The facts, however, stand in bold contrast to your view. Capitalist, Christian, free enterprise based societies are by far the most charitable, with the highest levels of volunteerism.
I don't expect you to understand or believe what you can't see for yourself though. I just do what I can and have faith that I'm trying to serve my God as he taught, while recognizing I will fall short of the mark, and am forgiven.
While the bolded statement is true, it is also true that the social democracies such as those in northern Europe are more generous and engaged in improving the lives of the poor than we are. I think that this is the Pope's point.
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  #14  
Old 11-27-2013, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wasillaguy View Post
Your assumptions, while dramatic, don't reflect my attitude at all. Your cynical stereotype of the cruel, selfish individualist is I'm sure a convenient outlet to direct your anger.
The facts, however, stand in bold contrast to your view. Capitalist, Christian, free enterprise based societies are by far the most charitable, with the highest levels of volunteerism.
I don't expect you to understand or believe what you can't see for yourself though. I just do what I can and have faith that I'm trying to serve my God as he taught, while recognizing I will fall short of the mark, and am forgiven.
Quote:
Originally Posted by finnbow View Post
While the bolded statement is true, it is also true that the social democracies such as those in northern Europe are more generous and engaged in improving the lives of the poor than we are. I think that this is the Pope's point.
Right. Less charity and volunteerism, because there is less need for it.

Also, there is no way to know whether one is forgiven until the end of ones life when whence he faces judgment. The whole pre-forgiven for events that have as yet to occur is a fallacy. It's like giving someone a pass at birth for any crimes he may commit later in life. It simply doesn't work that way.................unless you're born rich and connected, of course.

Dave
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Last edited by BlueStreak; 11-27-2013 at 09:19 AM.
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  #15  
Old 11-27-2013, 06:29 AM
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To cut to the chase, if an omniscient, omnipotent God, knowing everything that was going to happen, created the world the way it is on purpose, I cannot forgive Him.
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  #16  
Old 11-27-2013, 06:30 AM
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1st Corinthians 13 with the proper translation of agape.
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  #17  
Old 11-27-2013, 06:48 AM
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Originally Posted by merrylander View Post
1st Corinthians 13 with the proper translation of agape.
I hope 'charity' is a proper translation--I truly love the King James version of that.
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  #18  
Old 11-27-2013, 07:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueStreak View Post
Right. Less charity and volunteerism, because there is less need for it.

Also, there is no way to know whether one is forgiven until the end of ones when whence he faces judgment. The whole pre-forgiven for events that have as yet to occur is a fallacy. It's like giving someone a pass at birth for any crimes he may commit later in life. It simply doesn't work that way.................unless you're born rich and connected, of course.

Dave
The USA in 19th in terms of charitable giving as a percentage of Gross National Income. You'll note that nearly all of the countries above us are northern European social democracies who actually need less charity than we do. During my 11 years in Germany, I don't recall ever seeing a poor or destitute person. In contrast, the USA ranks #34 in the world in terms of percentage of children living in poverty.

Luxembourg – 1.00%
Sweden – 0.99%
Norway – 0.93%
Denmark – 0.84%
Netherlands – 0.71%
United Kingdom – 0.56%
Finland – 0.53%
Ireland – 0.48%
Belgium – 0.47%
France- 0.45%
Switzerland – 0.45%
Germany – 0.38%
Australia – 0.36%
Canada – 0.32%
Austria – 0.28%
New Zealand – 0.28%
Portugal – 0.27%
Iceland – 0.22%
United States – 0.19%

When it comes to the Pope's point, from 2009 - 2012 the top 1%'s income went up 31.4%, whereas the income of the bottom 99% went up 0.4%.

http://elsa.berkeley.edu/~saez/saez-...comes-2012.pdf
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Last edited by finnbow; 11-27-2013 at 07:24 AM.
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  #19  
Old 11-27-2013, 07:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donquixote99 View Post
I hope 'charity' is a proper translation--I truly love the King James version of that.
Actually DQ it is not. The Greeks had four words for 'love'. There is Phileo or brotherly love, Storge or affectionat love. Then Eros for sheer physical love. Agape is a self effacibg or unconditional love. I believe that the King James translators were thing of a charitable love which could be one translation of agape but its a stretch.

I also prefer the King James version, the new Revised Standard has all the poetry of a telephone directory. But I confess that using the proper translation only makes Paul's letter more powerful.
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Last edited by merrylander; 11-27-2013 at 12:13 PM.
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  #20  
Old 11-27-2013, 08:39 AM
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Look at all these Papists

I find it interesting that the a man who lives at the pinnacle of wealth and luxury has these things to say. I'd rather hear it from a guy like Bishop Myriel.

Pete
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