Hamas Attack in Israel

[finnbow]

“One of the most horrible features of war is that all the war-propaganda, all the screaming and lies and hatred, comes invariably from the people who are not fighting.”

- George Orwell.

[Pio1980]

Originally Posted by Ike Bana

And the fucking anti-Semitic "Squad" in the US House and guilt driven Jew liberals in the Knesset, and "balanced" journalists like Palki Sharma...all of these assholes floating their "the Jews brought this on themselves" bullshit. Yeah sure...and Jews brought the holocaust on themselves, and brought the pogroms on themselves, and brought "blood libel" on themselves.

Israel has been a consistent ally in the region, regardless of the questionable origin, but that shouldn't make us obligated to rubber stamp any/every objectionable policy and action they put into force.

That being said, radical actors are obviously cynically using their populations as moral shields for their own outrages by provoking enivitable reactions on them to claim victimhood.

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by Pio1980

Israel has been a consistent ally in the region, regardless of the questionable origin, but that shouldn't make us obligated to rubber stamp any/every objectionable policy and action they put into force.

That being said, radical actors are obviously cynically using their populations as moral shields for their own outrages by provoking enivitable reactions on them to claim victimhood.

I'm not prepared to critique what the Jews of Israel have decided they need to do to keep themselves from being driven into the sea as promised by their pacifist neighbors who only want peace.

Just imagine what would happen if the Mexicans decided that we had ripped them off when we gobbled up all that dirt out west...and that as a result, the new terrorist organization that took over the Mexican government started lobbing mortar rounds and launching rocket attacks into Corpus Christie and El Paso. Reckon how this country would be answering the deaths of a couple of thousand dead shitkickers quietly sitting in their homes watching the Cowboys on the big flat screen. If we didn't turn Mexico into a sheet of glass, we would certainly turn it into a parking lot.

So again, there's all kinds of pissing and moaning about Netanyahu, no problem, he's the Donald Trump of Israel. But we also know that everything the Israeli military has chosen to do to protect Israel is supported by Israelis. The IDF has an approval rating of over 90%.

[Pio1980]

The settlements encroachment into Palestinian areas as cynical intentional fait accompli land grab provocations are examples of the crap we are under no obligation to justify or endorse, and have nothing to do Israeli security or defense. They just provoke further resentment and reluctance to negotiate peace.

[Ike Bana]

Originally Posted by Pio1980

The settlements encroachment into Palestinian areas as cynical intentional fait accompli land grab provocations are examples of the crap we are under no obligation to justify or endorse, and have nothing to do Israeli security or defense. They just provoke further resentment and reluctance to negotiate peace.

There are no Israeli settlements in Gaza since they were all dismantled in 2005, and Gaza was completely handed over to the PLO, for it's fucking mismanagement. Israel took the West Bank in the '67 war because Israel was never going to be threatened by an attack from the middle of their country again. And let's get the situation straight about the West Bank. Prior to the Israeli occupation and annex of the West Bank, it had been occupied and annexed by Jordan in 1950. Palestinian groups protested the Jordanian annexation, and Jordan said no. Did Palestinian groups attack Jordan after it's annexation of the West Bank? No. Why? No Jews.

And if Jordan hadn't gotten on the wrong side of the 67 war and just stayed out of it, it's pretty good odds the West Bank would still be part of Jordan and there would be no terrorist groups in the WestBank because...no Jews.

[Mark B]

Originally Posted by Pio1980

The settlements encroachment into Palestinian areas as cynical intentional fait accompli land grab provocations are examples of the crap we are under no obligation to justify or endorse, and have nothing to do Israeli security or defense. They just provoke further resentment and reluctance to negotiate peace.

The whataboutism's in your posts are inappropriate, and real or perceived Israeli faults from it's entire history are not germane to the current issue of Israel defending its citizens from a horrific terrorist attack.

[Mark B]

Latest US intelligence on Gaza hospital attack:

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/18/polit...ast/index.html

"A spokesperson for the NSC, Adrienne Watson, said the assessment is based on analysis of overhead imagery, intercepts and open-source information.

“While we continue to collect information, our current assessment, based on analysis of overhead imagery, intercepts and open-source information, is that Israel is not responsible for the explosion at the hospital in Gaza yesterday,” Watson said in a statement on Wednesday."

[Dondilion]

We cry for the Palestinians: An Orthodox sound.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2H-F0HVKDY

[Pio1980]

Originally Posted by Mark B

The whataboutism's in your posts are inappropriate, and real or perceived Israeli faults from it's entire history are not germane to the current issue of Israel defending its citizens from a horrific terrorist attack.

It's not "whataboutism", it's about support for an ally when they deserve it, as in the present situation. Hamas brought the retaliation on themselves by their own actions. Israel doesn't deserve our support for anything/ everything when support isn't justified.
While I'm not qualified to litigate/ relitigate the historical situation in Palestine-Israel, my personal opinion on anti-Semitism is that it is a vile repugnant stain on human history.
Henry Ford should have been prosecuted for aiding and abetting the German Nazis' progroms and the final solution with his vigorous promoting anti-Semitism thru his propaganda rag.

[Oerets]

Israel is able to protect from and retaliate for the harm inflicted upon them.

Like any other country is expected to behave.

When it come to war and the after effects...



War is hell and bad things happen all the time. The reason war is not a intelligent response. Yet all miss steps by any is used to drive any narrative.

This is one where the top level negotiations with all parties is need. To insure no expansion rather a cessation of hostilities.

This conflict is in need of a solution. One with give and takes from both sides.